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MSFS/P3D Dream System


RU570M K4p4d14

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RU570M K4p4d14

Hello

With GPU prices dropping I am in a position to build a new system (since 2016) and would appreciate any thought from our wonderful community. Please feel free to make any suggestions as my primary use would be to run the FSLABS A320 in P3D V5 with maximum addons in terms of airport scenery and ORBX. Finally there would also be the intention to “future proof” for when MSFS becomes mainstream. 

So far I am constructing a build with Intel i7 processor and NVDIA GPU as these companies will work well with upcoming MSFS also. My main concern is to avoid bottle neck or a low FPS situation. 

CPU
i7-11700/11700K 

GPU
Currently the GPU situation all depends on price, would be ideal to buy at MSRP but can settle for a good compromise. 
Ideal: 3080TI
Most likely: 3080
Backup: 3070TI

MOBO
Open to suggestion

RAM
32GB DDR4 @ 3600MHZ 
32GB DDR3 @ 3600MHZ (Based on idea that 16GB will be insufficient for MSFS and addons)
16GB DDR4 or 5 (unsure)

SSD
250GB SSD (OS only)
1TB SSD (SIM/Gaming exclusive)
Primary for OS, secondary for flight simulator/gaming.

 

Thanks for your advice and will update as I go along!

 

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Artur Araripe

If you plan on futureproofing, might as well go with 32 GB instead as 16 is barely enough even for P3D v5. With certain sceneries, my usage goes all the way up to 21 GB sometimes. 16 is JUST enough to have P3D loaded, but if you use any flight trackers, vpilot, activesky, and so on, it will be a tight one. My system had only 16 GB previously and I had almost no RAM to spare while flying, so I couldn't even fire up Chrome or anything like that. CPU-wise, the i7 is fine, same goes for the GPU choice(s). But i'd really consider adding more RAM, even more so if you plan to play MSFS in the near future. Complex airports eat up a lot of RAM in MSFS (I saw usage as high as 27GB!). 

DDR5 is still a wee bit of hit or miss in terms of stability because it's new tech. 

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RU570M K4p4d14

Thanks Artur 

I am interested to know based on your knowledge of RAM if DDR3 @ 3600MHZ will be sufficient if I upgrade to 32GB. I am using all the usual external programs so based on what you said 16GB would not be enough.

Finally, in addition to the speed, does the type or “brand” of RAM matter or can I choose a lesser known brand to save on the final cost?

Thanks again. 

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Artur Araripe

DDR4, right? 3600 should be enough. RAM-wise, it's always good to go with a reputable brand that offers good warranty, like G.Skill (TridentZ series), CORSAIR, Kingston HyperX or Adata. Gotta make sure the module you want is fully compatible with the motherboard of choice, of course. Most manufacturers have a .pdf file with the modules that are fully compatible with the XMP profiles, etc. It's very important to make sure.  Cutting corners on RAM is never ideal because a good stick is crucial for stability. Although, nowadays, it doesn't matter as much as it did back in the day because it's either Samsung, Micron or Hynix anyway, and then it all comes down to the build quality and dissipating capabilities of the module. Also, make sure to prioritize low-latency modules (CL14) with B-die chips, for maximum gains. 

 

 

 

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RU570M K4p4d14

Thank you for your kind reply. It would be DDR3, do you consider that a factor, upgrading is possible otherwise. 

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Artur Araripe

DDR3 is phased out at this point. If you really want DDR3, you'd have to use a LGA 1150 compatible processor (like an i7 4790K from 2014), which is far from ideal at this point. Anything newer than 2015 is already DDR4, so unfortunately there's no escaping from it unless you really want an ancient processor + mobo combo. Not to mention the fact it would lack the horsepower to drive a 3070/3080 to its full potential. I'd look no further than a GTX 1080TI if I were after a card to pair with a flagship CPU from 2014. 4c/8t nowadays is simply not enough, mostly with applications in general finally taking proper multithreading into account. So yea, if you really want a futureproof rig, aim for an 11700K at the very least. Preferably a 12700K. Multithreading is the present and it's certainly gonna be the future as well. More and more applications/games are making proper use of the threads, which makes sense, given the popularization of 6/12, 8/16 combos out there.

 

 

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RU570M K4p4d14

Thank you! Yes will be DDR4 and 11th GEN CPU to pair with 3080 along those lines. 

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Markus Burkhard

Make sure to get plenty of M.2 SSD space, also since you are keeping MSFS in mind. SATA SSDs are getting slow for today's simulators, as they max out at around 550MB/s, where as a PCIe 4 M.2 drive gives you 6000MB/s plus.

Best CPU for flight simming to get right now would be a Intel 12700K, if your budget allows that would be my recommendation instead of 11th gen Intel.

If you can, choose a 3080Ti to get some additional headroom for VRAM over the 3080.

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RU570M K4p4d14

Thanks Markus,

Drive wise I will most definitely be going for SSD, along the lines of M2/NVME as a given. Not sure which is better but I will continue to figure that out. Do you think there is a drastic difference between SATA SSD and the M2/NVME types, would be interesting to know. (Simply because I am booting my current OS from SATA SSD and it is still pretty fast)

Unfortunately price wise I have already settled on INTEL 11700 CPU but again can push for the 12700K if you think it will make a major difference?

As for GPU, yes 3080TI would be ideal.

Thank you for your kind input! 

 

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  • Norman Blackburn changed the title to MSFS/P3D Dream System
Markus Burkhard

It really depends on the workflow as to how drastic the difference is seen between SATA SSD and M.2/NVMe PCIe 4. I'm not sure that a simulator can make use of peak read and write performance of the latter during a flight, but the larger the files, the more you will gain by having more speed than SATA3 can provide. And as we know there are plenty of large files in our sims, bgl files in the gigabyte range or large quantities of 4K / 8K textures. 

In order to make use of something like 7000MB/s peak performance, I guess other tasks such as working with raw video files or studio quality photographs will be more suited.
However, the question of NVMe vs. SATA can not only be one about peak performance. At some point you would also want to look at possible bottlenecks in your system. Meaning that if you have a fast current CPU and GPU coupled with high-speed RAM, you would not want to create a bottleneck by feeding those components with SATA3 bandwidth only. Not that it won't be usable, but there can be tasks where you'd not be using the full capability of your CPU and GPU because the system is just slow to provide data to work with. 

Of course there are tasks were SATA3 SSDs are still perfectly fine to use, such as file storage, or installing applications that use only minimal data volumes. 

As for 11th gen Intel vs 12th gen, this really depends on the price difference you can get. How much would you save on the mainboard, and how much on the CPU?

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Daniel Jaffe

NVMe vs. Sata SSD, for me, it's like night and day.  Remember, it's not just the time the sim is running, it impacts lots of other things like file copy times, etc.  There are a lot of big files in flight simming -- and they only seem to get bigger.  I have three NVMe's in my system, and it's one of the best choices I made -- along with lots of RAM.

And let me be clear, I had the luxury of picking up some top notch equipment because I also use this computer for work.  So economics was not as big a factor.

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Julian Roschlau

Hi,

it looks like you are trying to do pretty much the same thing I just did.
I built a new system for P3Dv5 (and MSFS in the future) about 3 weeks ago.

I mainly fly the FSLabs Airbus with many other add ons (all the OrbX stuff - Vector, Landclass, Global, all the popular payware scenery airports, AIG Traffic set to 99%, EnvShade, Chaseplane, REX SkyForce, Active Sky).

I am going to attach my settings in P3D below. There are a couple of sliders I have not set all the way but I am just really happy with how it looks and runs right now. I have not tried out any higher settings yet. I am running at 3440x1440 on a G-Sync monitor. I need to turn on V-Sync for some reason, otherwise I get tearing while panning in the VC.

So far, the system is performing incredibly well. I am at around 40-50 fps most of the time, it might go down to 30 occasionally. It does get hotter than my old CPU but everything is stable.

Here are my specs:

CPU
i7-12700K

The price difference to the 11700K is only about 60 Euros where I live - so that is something to consider, especially since the new 12th gen chips use the new sockets and chipsets (might be better for future upgrades). That will, however, limit you to a more expensive Motherboard.

GPU
Gigabyte 3080TI

Yes, it is very expensive - but the Ti was less overpriced than the 3070 and 3080, although it was more expensive considering the MSRP (Hope that makes sense)
Consider VRAM - P3D with high settings uses a lot of VRAM. Once I arrive at a major European airport and look at the pretty Airbus while it is being unloaded, the VRAM counter is at around 8GB. I am so glad I went with a 12GB VRAM GPU. 8 would not have been enough.
So the 10GB 3080 should be the minimum as you only get around 9 available in P3D if I am not mistaken.

MOBO
Gigabyte Z690 AORUS PRO DDR5
I went with one of the new Z690 boards and having been stuck on DDR3 Ram for the last 8 years I just wanted the latest and greatest.
The board was recommended by Steve from GamersNexus on YouTube.

I did have to update the Bios before it would even POST as it did not recognize my RAM. (Early adopter troubles I guess)

 

RAM
Corsair Vengeance 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-5600 CL36

SSD
I used my old M.2 drive and 2 old SSDs but got myself a Samsung 970 EVO Plus 2TB M.2 as my system drive (where I also installed P3D)

 

So these are my settings right now and it runs very nicely. So to me, this is kind of my dream system right now :)

hope this helps

 

image.thumb.png.672c30b16f250e29870b850dbeccdbee.png

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image.thumb.png.8e667bf501943ac0dbadc0b3c2ff4cb5.png

 

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RU570M K4p4d14

Thanks everyone for your kind inputs, I am pleased to confirm I have gone ahead and built a system. Unfortunately not with the exact specs as above but along the lines of what was available in terms of stock and within price. 

Ultimately settled with the below.

CPU

i7-11700 - The non “K” variant due to price.
i7-11700/11700K 

GPU

NVDIA RTX 3080 “OC edition” from ASUS. 
Currently the GPU situation all depends on price, would be ideal to buy at MSRP but can settle for a good compromise. 
Ideal: 3080TI
Most likely: 3080
Backup: 3070TI

MOBO
ASUS B450 motherboard - Cheaper MOBO due to having non “K” variant CPU.

RAM

16GB DDR4 @ 3600MHZ (G.Skill) with XMP profile activated. - Let’s see how this goes, again due to price have taken 16GB initially with view to upgrade shortly. 
32GB DDR4 @ 3600MHZ 
32GB DDR3 @ 3600MHZ (Based on idea that 16GB will be insufficient for MSFS and addons)
16GB DDR4 or 5 (unsure)

SSD

250GB SATA SSD for OS/services and Kingston 1TB NVME SSD for P3D/gaming use. - Again, SATA SSD due to price.
250GB SSD (OS only)
1TB SSD (SIM/Gaming exclusive)

Primary for OS, secondary for flight simulator/gaming.

Upgrades:

Possibly will look to upgrade to “K” variant processor in future if i711700 is not sufficient but from what I understand, it only has 0.1GHZ less on the Intel boost speed. Will definitely look to upgrading to 32GB of ram as kindly advised above. 

Questions:

1. Should resizable-bar option be enabled in BIOS to take advantage of this feature, I have seen mixed reviews.

2. Will upgrading to P3D v5 be worth it, especially from a financial standpoint. Considering FSLABS, FENIX, PMDG and most other developers do have plans to shift over perhaps it is better to go directly from P3D 4.5 to MSFS when the time is right.

3. Any other tips/guidance to point me at when it comes to the actual setup of P3D. 

Again thank you to all who have helped! I am extremely excited. Feel free to offer any suggestions to the build as it will surely be upgraded in the near future! 

 

 

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Markus Burkhard
4 hours ago, RU570M K4p4d14 said:

Upgrades:

Possibly will look to upgrade to “K” variant processor in future if i711700 is not sufficient but from what I understand, it only has 0.1GHZ less on the Intel boost speed. Will definitely look to upgrading to 32GB of ram as kindly advised above. 

Questions:

2. Will upgrading to P3D v5 be worth it, especially from a financial standpoint. Considering FSLABS, FENIX, PMDG and most other developers do have plans to shift over perhaps it is better to go directly from P3D 4.5 to MSFS when the time is right.

Upgrading from a 11700 to a 11700K would be pointless. You'd only see a few points increase in some benchmarks, but it would not yield any performance increase in real workload scenarios. Even upgrading to a 11900K CPU would not be worth it, because then you'd need a higher-performance mainboard platform to actually take advantage of that CPU, and it would still give you only marginally better performance, since raw CPU power is only one of many parts of PC performance.
The 11700 CPU is quite well performing, upgrading it would only start to make sense if the 13th generation Intel i7/i9 came along or the next generation AMD platform.

By all means double your amount of RAM once able, then your system will be perfectly good to go for the time being.

Upgrading to P3D v5 would make a lot of sense, since it would allow you to make use of your new hardware capabilities much more than with v4, due to DirectX12. The performance increase between v4 and v5 is fantastic. So having bought yourself a new PC system is the perfect time to do that upgrade.

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RU570M K4p4d14

Thank you @Markus Burkhard

Appreciate the tips. To be honest I will go with V4.5 for now as my plan is to move directly to MSFS when the FENIX/FSLABS (or similar standard) A320 becomes available. This is only to save time (compatibility) and money. However, out of curiosity is everything in V4.5 compatible with V5 or does this come at a price? I know the FSLABS is, which is a good start! (If I were tempted) 

@Julian Roschlau Thanks for your post as well, really helped. To be honest I was hesitant to go for a build right now as I understand new cards are on the way and prices are going to drop dramatically, but good to see someone in the same boat as me. Perhaps even if they do drop, we still have pretty decent systems to fuel our passions!

@Artur Araripe 32GB to come soon! @Daniel Jaffe Thanks as well, 1TB SSD NVME from Kingston is onboard, strangely enough it cost less than the 250GB SATA SSD for my OS. Perhaps this is due to the brand?

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Daniel Jaffe
16 minutes ago, RU570M K4p4d14 said:

 Thanks as well, 1TB SSD NVME from Kingston is onboard, strangely enough it cost less than the 250GB SATA SSD for my OS. Perhaps this is due to the brand?

This price disparity makes no sense to me.  In addition, I would put my system on the fastest drive, which is the NVMe.  And if the NVMe is cheaper than the SSD, why not just get two NVMe?  Regardless, congrats.

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RU570M K4p4d14

Apologies, I wrote incorrectly, the 250GB SATA SSD for OS is cheaper than the 1TB NVME SSD. What I meant to say is that the store was selling 1TB Kingston cheaper than 500GB of another brand (I think Samsung) or something along those lines.

Yes I definitely notice the OS takes time to boot up, around 30 seconds which I am happy with. (But it is noticeable!)

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Daniel Jaffe
3 minutes ago, RU570M K4p4d14 said:

Apologies, I wrote incorrectly, the 250GB SATA SSD for OS is cheaper than the 1TB NVME SSD. What I meant to say is that the store was selling 1TB Kingston cheaper than 500GB of another brand (I think Samsung) or something along those lines.

Yes I definitely notice the OS takes time to boot up, around 30 seconds which I am happy with. (But it is noticeable!)

Ah.  That makes sense.  Hard to know on the pricing difference.  Glad you grabbed it in any case.

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Markus Burkhard
1 hour ago, RU570M K4p4d14 said:

Appreciate the tips. To be honest I will go with V4.5 for now as my plan is to move directly to MSFS when the FENIX/FSLABS (or similar standard) A320 becomes available. This is only to save time (compatibility) and money. However, out of curiosity is everything in V4.5 compatible with V5 or does this come at a price? I know the FSLABS is, which is a good start! (If I were tempted) 

Just don't expect a selection of FSL-like fidelity aircraft to be ready for MSFS the day after tomorrow. Same goes for the environment. Who knows when Asobo will be ready to provide a weather system that is even half as feature rich and accurate as ActiveSky is, something that is very important to accurate airliner simulation.
This leaves you plenty of time to enjoy a v5 upgrade in the meantime. Most software does not have extra cost for v5, you just need to get new installers with compatible versions. Of course there's a scenery here and there that might need an upgrade, but that should not keep you from enjoying the fantastic performance and visuals benefits of P3D v5. I still think it's a neat deal to pay 60 Dollars for v5 and get a much better experience. 

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Markus Burkhard
1 hour ago, RU570M K4p4d14 said:

Thanks @Markus Burkhard well that does seem reasonable! I’m just surprised you managed to convince me so easily, spoken like a true politician. 

If you're worried about cost next to the base sim, then I suggest you check out your favourite add-ons for new installers before you purchase P3D v5. That way you'll know if and how many of them will need an upgrade purchase.

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Daniel Jacoby

How exciting

 

Your specified specs are all in the category of sufficient, so that’s good.

One thing I’d point out as someone who has a similar system to what you’ve described, VRAM is a big issue in V5. 

In sceneries like EHAM with ORBX TE I often run out of VRAM so the 3080ti would be the way to go here. I’d also recommend picking a 32GB Ram because that’s exactly future-proofing.

CPU-wise, the new intel 12gen is incredible so an i7 should be enough.

I hope all goes well with your new build, have fun flying!

  • Like 1
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RU570M K4p4d14

Thanks Daniel,

Yes I picked up 32GB of RAM now, much smoother experience. Only thing is I am still getting 18-20FPS in the big airports like Heathrow when flying over the city on short approach. (I guess this is a P3D thing) 

I am not sure if anyone has similar specs to me who can advice for P3D v4.5? I did not make the jump to V5 yet as I will be purchasing MSFS the moment FENIX is released so financially made sense to skip all together. 

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RU570M K4p4d14

Guys, very strange thing but I noticed that with hyper-threading OFF, there is a gain of 5-10FPS in some areas. Would anyone be able to confirm? I see mixed reviews on the forum.

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Norman Blackburn
12 minutes ago, RU570M K4p4d14 said:

Guys, very strange thing but I noticed that with hyper-threading OFF, there is a gain of 5-10FPS in some areas. Would anyone be able to confirm? I see mixed reviews on the forum.

We have always suggested HT off.

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