My experience with a Real World A321 Neo

[Ray Proudfoot]

What am I doing writing about my experience with the A321Neo when I don’t own it? 

Simple really. I flew on one yesterday from Manchester to Tenerife South. I had selected a seat with extra legroom in 30A. An emergency exit row.

Just one tiny problem. It had no window near me. So my visibility throughout the flight was restricted to twisting my head to my left to see a tiny view out of the window behind me.

Never, ever choose row 30 unless you want a similar experience.

One question for the flight planners. It departed 23L on a EKLAD departure but didn’t turn south until over Dublin. The question “why?” was put to cabin crew on my Jet2 flight but their answer made no sense. Any clarification would be appreciated.

In the meantime enjoy your rather better views from the pointy end. 

[David Arthur]

17 hours ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Just one tiny problem. It had no window near me. So my visibility throughout the flight was restricted to twisting my head to my left to see a tiny view out of the window behind me

No window seat!? Oh no! 
I took my whole tribe to Italy recently, we flew Bristol - Pisa on an EasyJet A321.

On the way out, before pushback the captain announced that takeoff was going to be delayed for up to an hour whilst we waited for a slot. He then asked if any children would like to come up to the flight deck and have a look and they’d take questions - which I thought was pretty decent of him.

To my amazement nobody took their kids up to have a peek. I’m not sure what this says about modern curiosity or the ubiquity of air travel these days?

My eldest son and I decided to take them up on their generous offer and insinuated ourselves onto the flight deck by declaring that like all men we were still eight years old at heart! Very interesting experience; I think they were slightly surprised but appreciative of our questions;

”Where do you think we’ll be at top of decent?”

”Ah, well that depends…”

The First officer was 21 and this was his second month on the job. Very nice young man indeed.

On the return journey I bagged one of the window seats by pulling grandad rank…

Time lapse over the Alps on the way back;

I dunno why I bother with an expensive DSLR these days. This was taken using my wife's iphone.

[John Nesbit]

20 hours ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

What am I doing writing about my experience with the A321Neo when I don’t own it? 

Simple really. I flew on one yesterday from Manchester to Tenerife South. I had selected a seat with extra legroom in 30A. An emergency exit row.

Just one tiny problem. It had no window near me. So my visibility throughout the flight was restricted to twisting my head to my left to see a tiny view out of the window behind me.

Never, ever choose row 30 unless you want a similar experience.

One question for the flight planners. It departed 23L on a EKLAD departure but didn’t turn south until over Dublin. The question “why?” was put to cabin crew on my Jet2 flight but their answer made no sense. Any clarification would be appreciated.

In the meantime enjoy your rather better views from the pointy end. 

Hello Ray

Being a flight planner myself in career mode, Im not sure why exactly but my guess would be off the top of my head part of a noise abatement procedure or conflicting traffic or maybe the controller just had not had his coffee yet..  Most of the time IRL flights get off the ground and then are handled to maintain safe separation and congestion due to other airborne traffic and this very well could amend the SID or STAR or even the flight routing the plane is following to its destination. 

Uhm I generally would not query the cabin crew on circumstances regarding flight parameters but I have been known to stop into the cockpit at the end of a flight and have a chat with the pilots. Im not saying cabin crew do not actually know the answer, some might, but as a general rule of thumb personally, i wont ask.

I enjoyed your timelapse video, its so pretty out there over the Alps, I want to one day travel to see them up close. 

Enjoy your trip if you are still on it... Thanks for sharing

John

[Trevor Hannant]

A lot of flights up/down there head through Shannon’s airspace instead of continental Europe due to lower route charges on the Tango routes

[Ray Proudfoot]

@David Arthur, thanks for your post. In 50 years of flying I’ve never come across an emergency exit seat with no window. Given you pay a premium for extra legroom you’d think they’d design things better. Not sure if it’s widespread across the 321Neo range or just Jet2.

I have a different numbered extra legroom seat on the return. Hopefully with a window.

Strange how few were interested in seeing the flight deck. I’ve chatted to Monarch pilots in the past after parking to thank them and for a general chinwag.

That’s a nice video with a phone. But I still love my Nikon DSLR that gives you greater control of speed and shutter if those are important to you. Plus they don’t need an upgrade in five years when the security contract runs out.

 

[Ray Proudfoot]

3 hours ago, John Nesbit said:

Being a flight planner myself in career mode, Im not sure why exactly but my guess would be off the top of my head part of a noise abatement procedure or conflicting traffic or maybe the controller just had not had his coffee yet..  Most of the time IRL flights get off the ground and then are handled to maintain safe separation and congestion due to other airborne traffic and this very well could amend the SID or STAR or even the flight routing the plane is following to its destination.

We completed the SID to near Liverpool Airport after which I hoped a left turn down Wales would commence. It didn’t until Dublin which is now probably for cost saving reasons rather than getting the aircraft to the destination at the published time. We took off at 14:20 and landed at 19:10 so 4h50m is longer than the 4h 30m published journey.

@Trevor Hannant, it seems that way but the return last October was over Cardiff then Liverpool which is much further east and perfectly normal. Let’s see what happens next Monday.

[John Nesbit]

@Ray Proudfoot

ahhhhh.. Ok.. i guess in some way it makes sense... 

[Ray Proudfoot]

2 hours ago, John Nesbit said:

@Ray Proudfoot

ahhhhh.. Ok.. i guess in some way it makes sense... 

Indeed. I just wish the captain or first officer would explain the reasons for the routing. It was pretty obvious to me even without a clear view we were going quite a way off the most obvious route.

[Lefteris Kalamaras]

(I changed Ray's title to reflect more accurately what he intended to post, because he's made it very clear he's not a believer of flying digital computers, he prefers analog ones).

[James Brierley]

Hi Ray,

The flight planning systems are setup to chose the cheapest route option (with regard to overflight and airspace costs) available that works best with the current wind data set available. It's very common to see EKLAD departures get an early direct routing to the Tango routes initial point which would likely to have been waypoint OMOKO or similar depending on traffic levels routing via the T16 airway.

Thanks

[Trevor Hannant]

15 hours ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

We completed the SID to near Liverpool Airport after which I hoped a left turn down Wales would commence. It didn’t until Dublin which is now probably for cost saving reasons rather than getting the aircraft to the destination at the published time. We took off at 14:20 and landed at 19:10 so 4h50m is longer than the 4h 30m published journey.

@Trevor Hannant, it seems that way but the return last October was over Cardiff then Liverpool which is much further east and perfectly normal. Let’s see what happens next Monday.

As James says, it varies every time.  For example, the last 6 flights of LS829 (EXS34R) have all gone west then down through Shannon's airspace.  The several before that took the "traditional" route with another batch of West -> South before that:

https://www.flightradar24.com/data/flights/ls829

From my time at Swanwick in the South West sectors up to beginning of last year, I've seen them head down then cut across Wales also - so it really is unpredictable on what you'll get day to day dependant on a number of factors

[Ray Proudfoot]

2 hours ago, Lefteris Kalamaras said:

(I changed Ray's title to reflect more accurately what he intended to post, because he's made it very clear he's not a believer of flying digital computers, he prefers analog ones).

Greetings Lefteris! Just to remind you what the great man said which I’m sure you remember…

”But as John Hutchinson once famously said… “This is a proper flight deck. None of this poncy glass cockpit rubbish. These are proper instruments with needles and dials.”

Not just me old chap. And having flown in the A321NEO I have to say it’s no better than any other medium-range twin engine aircraft as far as passenger comfort is concerned. Still packed in like sardines except for my row where I could have more legroom than the late Queen had on Concorde but no window! 

Just as well the cockpit is full of buttons and gizmos. 

[Ray Proudfoot]

2 hours ago, James Brierley said:

Hi Ray,

The flight planning systems are setup to chose the cheapest route option (with regard to overflight and airspace costs) available that works best with the current wind data set available. It's very common to see EKLAD departures get an early direct routing to the Tango routes initial point which would likely to have been waypoint OMOKO or similar depending on traffic levels routing via the T16 airway.

Hi James. Why don’t Ryanair use this route? Or perhaps they do and I’ve not spotted it. When I flew it last October we cut across the NW tip of Spain so clearly it was a different route back then.

I don’t have access to PFPX so can’t see where OMOKO is.

[John Nesbit]

15 hours ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Indeed. I just wish the captain or first officer would explain the reasons for the routing. It was pretty obvious to me even without a clear view we were going quite a way off the most obvious route.

Exactly and I hear you.. But you and I are among the very minority of the traveling public who have the interest and the knowledge to be curious as to what is going on and why. Generally we can explain it without even asking. but in reality I still get an internal kick out of watching the way most passengers get off and behave when they go on an airplane somewhere..

 

[Ray Proudfoot]

2 hours ago, Trevor Hannant said:

From my time at Swanwick…

Thanks for the info. Did you know Pete Pitman? He was at Swanwick and was invaluable in helping with the correct ICAO enunciations and rules for Radar Contact v4. We’re talking 20 years ago.

[Trevor Hannant]

Looooong after that Ray...

[James Brierley]

16 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Hi James. Why don’t Ryanair use this route? Or perhaps they do and I’ve not spotted it. When I flew it last October we cut across the NW tip of Spain so clearly it was a different route back then.

I don’t have access to PFPX so can’t see where OMOKO is.

Hi Ray,

OMOKO is just off the South West coast into the Atlantic. The aircraft need to have certain PBN equipment to enable it to travel through, along with CPDLC and equipped with ADS-C capability. Ryanair have a fair few of mixed bag jets, so I think only a handful of them can do it!

 

Cheers
James