FSL Spotlights causes GPU Driver crash

[rjsict]

12 hours ago, admiralaspen said:

Try this:

A. Either run Prepar3D with an affinity mask that blocks P3D from using Core 0 Affinity Mask Calculator

B. Before you proceed past the Scenario/Startup Screen, open task manager go to the "Information" Tab, look for Prepar3D.exe and right click, choose "Affinity", uncheck core 0, load sim, right click again and check core 0 again.

The reason behind this lies within the DX11 API. DX11 mainthread lies ONLY on Core 0, which btw is where Prepar3D will place it's main texture thread. So this can help those that get the DXGI error during loading screen or shortly thereafter.

Folks, try this!! Seems to work for me so far... Set my affinity mask to 116 (taking threads off Core 0) and no issues so far!

 

I have a 3770K HT enabled hence 116. Was previously on 85 when the DXGI errors appeared with FS Spotlights enabled.

 

Russ

[S_r_d_a_n K_o_s_t_i_c]

11 hours ago, Lefteris Kalamaras said:

I am still thinking there's something in P3D's code however to cause DXGI errors, as they are definitely reported without Spotlights installed.

The fact is also that I can cause DXGI in P3D with too much overclock on my GPU. Just pushing the slider up while P3D is running is going to trigger it.

So I think it's not only software.

But apparently there are software components that cause it too, as it's across the board. You must have hit the right "button", whatever it is...

Please keep me posted... thx.

[ai_ab]

19 hours ago, rjsict said:

Folks, try this!! Seems to work for me so far... Set my affinity mask to 116 (taking threads off Core 0) and no issues so far!

 

I have a 3770K HT enabled hence 116. Was previously on 85 when the DXGI errors appeared with FS Spotlights enabled.

 

Russ

I have tested multiple AffinityMask settings in January and if I set AffinityMask for P3D to not use CP0 - this results in long texture loading times including black textures of the buildings in the payware sceneries, black textures of the AI aircraft and blurry terrain textures. Black textures load within 10-20 seconds if no additional tweaks are applied to prepar3d.cfg. If I set TEXTURE_BANDWIDTH_MULT to the value of about 480 this improves black texture loading time by about 40%. As for the terrain textures they load around the aircraft at initial loading of the simulator, however, if you fly out of this are the textures do not load anymore and blurry textures are everywhere. Well probably these texture can eventually load, however, this does not happen in the reasonable amount of time.

That said AffinityMask=85 results in best performance with reasonable time for textures to load on my PC.

As for the second part of your post - it seems to me that you can do this at any moment and it should work. At least on Win 10.

You can also use AM=84 to not load CPU0. This AM settings provided +6-10FPS compared to 85 at the cost of the textures and provided better frame rate compared to 168 or 170.

 

I have recorded this video after loading the aircraft and the scenery.

[S_r_d_a_n K_o_s_t_i_c]

48 minutes ago, ai_ab said:

I have tested multiple AffinityMask settings in January and if I set AffinityMask for P3D to not use CP0 - this results in long texture loading times including black textures of the buildings in the payware sceneries, black textures of the AI aircraft and blurry terrain textures. Black textures load within 10-20 seconds if no additional tweaks are applied to prepar3d.cfg. If I set TEXTURE_BANDWIDTH_MULT to the value of about 480 this improves black texture loading time by about 40%. As for the terrain textures they load around the aircraft at initial loading of the simulator, however, if you fly out of this are the textures do not load anymore and blurry textures are everywhere. Well probably these texture can eventually load, however, this does not happen in the reasonable amount of time.

That said AffinityMask=85 results in best performance with reasonable time for textures to load on my PC.

As for the second part of your post - it seems to me that you can do this at any moment and it should work. At least on Win 10.

You can also use AM=84 to not load CPU0. This AM settings provided +6-10FPS compared to 85 at the cost of the textures and provided better frame rate compared to 168 or 170.

I pretty much agree to this. I have, after a long time, tried AM to turn off Core0 in P3D. Bad...really bad. Stutters, problems with textures etc.

I just leave it outside of my .cfg and I'm good.

[ai_ab]

1 hour ago, Kosta said:

I pretty much agree to this. I have, after a long time, tried AM to turn off Core0 in P3D. Bad...really bad. Stutters, problems with textures etc.

I just leave it outside of my .cfg and I'm good.

As I have posted in one of the threads earlier if I do not use AM in prepar3d.cfg the performance is worse. However, each setup is individual and what works well on one computer might not work on another. Also AM settings for P3D might be different from those for FSX.

Anyway, do you redistribute the load from CPU0 when you have issues? Or is it loaded to 100%?

[S_r_d_a_n K_o_s_t_i_c]

I don't touch the load really. And afaik, I was also able to make it crash with Core0 free.


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[ai_ab]

18 hours ago, Kosta said:

The fact is also that I can cause DXGI in P3D with too much overclock on my GPU. Just pushing the slider up while P3D is running is going to trigger it.

So I think it's not only software.

But apparently there are software components that cause it too, as it's across the board. You must have hit the right "button", whatever it is...

Please keep me posted... thx.

The first time I have received DXGI error in P3D was after installing P3D HF2, when LM have introduced:  Added notifications for when a graphics card driver crashes.  

Can you try adding the following line to the the prepar3d.cfg and see whether the drivers crash or not while you switch windows?

http://prepar3d.com/news/2016/12/113902/

• Can be disabled by setting ShowDeviceLostWarning = 0 under the Graphics section in the Prepar3D.cfg.

[S_r_d_a_n K_o_s_t_i_c]

On one of the posts I had a whole series of tests for Lefteris, including older Clients and drivers.

The crash was consistent (it "happened"), but on older it didn't display the DXGI, it didn't display the error, but only blacked out.

In all cases there is a System Event Log entry: Display driver nvlddmkm stopped responding and has successfully recovered.

With the entry in P3D, the behavior is like in the older client.

[jacekw]

On 2/2/2017 at 4:10 PM, Sabre said:

That's similar to what I had after I installed Spotlights. Cost me a few days of sweat and anger before I found the solution: following FSLabs_RecommendedSettings_P3D_v2.pdf I changed Special Effects to High (both) from my Medium settings without giving much notice to it. And after that I could not load any scenario except for those with FSL Airbus A320x in them. First I discovered that disabling Spotlights entry in XML.DLL fixed my problems with all other aircrafts but the FSLabs Airbus. I rolled back and forth from/to P3Dv3 hf2 and v3.3.5 before I finally remembered that I changed Special Effects to High. Setting them back to Medium immediately fixed all my problems with XGI_ERROR_DEVICE_HUNG IN P3Dv3 hf2 and CTD in P3Dv3.3.5!!

I'm sure Spotlights's DLL vs. Special Effects on High must be looked into.

Igor.

Hi,

Many thanks Igor for this suggestion. I have changed Special Effects from HIGH to MEDIUM and all the problems with XGI_ERROR_DEVICE_HUNG IN my P3D3.4 H3 and CTD desapear...

CM

 

[Nuno M Pinto]

On 2/10/2017 at 7:41 AM, ai_ab said:

 

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I have recorded this video after loading the aircraft and the scenery.

What you describe in the video does work (for me at least), it stops CORE0 from being always at 100% and in the immediate vicinity of the aircraft, looking through the cockpit, the somewhat blurry terrain just ahead becomes clearer.

So, the immediate consequence is that somehow CORE0 is no longer overloaded and can render terrain faster around my LOD RADIUS, making blurred terrain appear a bit farther. This is interesting

[ai_ab]

7 minutes ago, Nuno M Pinto said:

What you describe in the video does work (for me at least), it stops CORE0 from being always at 100% and in the immediate vicinity of the aircraft, looking through the cockpit, the somewhat blurry terrain just ahead becomes clearer.

So, the immediate consequence is that somehow CORE0 is no longer overloaded and can render terrain faster around my LOD RADIUS, making blurred terrain appear a bit farther. This is interesting

As I have stated CPU0 is responsible for terrain rendering (well, at least in P3D). And that's exactly the reason why I am against advising setting AffinityMask to not use CPU0 in P3D.

[Nuno M Pinto]

Yes, i use 85 on a Core i7 6700k with HT enabled. I'm usually in the 60fps mark with vsync and triple buffering on with a 980Ti.

[Hendrik Herryjanto]

I get followed a tip for TDR fix for AMD card by adding this to regedit; go to:HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentcontrolSet\Control\GraphicsDrivers

and add entry of QWORD (64bit) or DWORD (32bit) depending on your OS then rename to TdrDelay and edit value date to 8 (hexadecimal).

Once I tried that I did get an error saying that P3D could not get access to Hardware acceleration then I change the value to 16.

Until now I havent got any error yet. I dont really know what it does but can someone try it as well to see if this helps

[S_r_d_a_n K_o_s_t_i_c]

Quote

 

Hendrik,

This explains what it does and what are the settings:

https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/hardware/ff569918(v=vs.85).aspx

According to that, TdrDelay:

Specifies the number of seconds that the GPU can delay the preempt request from the GPU scheduler. This is effectively the timeout threshold. The default value is 2 seconds.

So it makes absolutely no sense that with 8 seconds (which is already way up from default 2 seconds) P3D couldn't gain access to the GPU... moreover, the setting only implies a timeout.

I will try testing it, but you can see somehow, between the tech info and your report there are some discrepancies.

But please, keep this thread about what it's about (drivers), and let's keep the DXGI discussion on the other thread. Thanks.

 

Just to follow up quickly:

Tried, and as I suspected. TdrDelay only delays the message - doesn't prevent it, if a driver crashes, it doesn't take 2 seconds (default) but whatever you set.

DebugMode and Level is what actually makes a difference. However, messing with these can make serious problems: for instance, changing Level will prevent P3D from loading whatsoever... for instance, I wasn't able to deactivate it, weird enough - GPUZ would crash, P3D no load etc..

And btw. what you wrote about DWORD and QWORD, wrong. Not in this case, just read the MS page.

[Benjamin Hennes]

47 minutes ago, Kosta said:

Just to follow up quickly:

Tried, and as I suspected. TdrDelay only delays the message - doesn't prevent it, if a driver crashes, it doesn't take 2 seconds (default) but whatever you set.

DebugMode and Level is what actually makes a difference. However, messing with these can make serious problems: for instance, changing Level will prevent P3D from loading whatsoever... for instance, I wasn't able to deactivate it, weird enough - GPUZ would crash, P3D no load etc..

And btw. what you wrote about DWORD and QWORD, wrong. Not in this case, just read the MS page.

Should be possible to disable and not only delay TDR from the registry. Have you tried that? 

[S_r_d_a_n K_o_s_t_i_c]

37 minutes ago, Benjamin said:

Should be possible to disable and not only delay TDR from the registry. Have you tried that? 

Yes, of course. It finally worked when I set it up as DWORD, as per MSDN site. But not really sure if it would fix anything, so I reverted.

[Hendrik Herryjanto]

On 2/13/2017 at 1:08 AM, Kosta said:

Yes, of course. It finally worked when I set it up as DWORD, as per MSDN site. But not really sure if it would fix anything, so I reverted.

Hi Kosta, 

Thanks for all the help. I discover something but perhaps you already know it. 

1. If I have Spotlight installed then load up any a/c, default or PMDG or FSL, once it reaches 100% within a few seconds (+/- 3 seconds) I will get DXGI error. In this case I have a work around. Once the loading reaches 100% I quickly disable Spotlights through the menu. If I do this I never get DXGI error.

2. 

On 2/10/2017 at 8:41 AM, ai_ab said:

 

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I have recorded this video after loading the aircraft and the scenery.

If I follow that step but on the scenario page (before I load a plane/saved file) then i would not get DXGI error. In this case I can see that the load is spread equally among all 4 cores. With step 1 above during loading the load is mostly falls on core 0. I repeat this method many times and gets a consistent result.

FYI: I reinstalled W10 64bit and did not have any other addons installed and tried both method above. After that I decided to start installing addons and tried the methods above. In both case I get the same result of method 1 and 2.

I hope you understand what I mean. Should I make upload a video?

Regards

 

[S_r_d_a_n K_o_s_t_i_c]

Hendrik,

I see you are able to reproduce this error on regular basis, correct?

EDITED, should read better.

[S_r_d_a_n K_o_s_t_i_c]

Please try this:

And in NI:

And I hope you are not overclocking...

A shot in the dark really (again).

[Hendrik Herryjanto]

Kosta,

Yes I am able to reproduce this constantly. When I reinstalled W10 I didn't installed any other software all basic, no MS office, no AV. My GPU driver is installed by W10 and it is from AMD itself (the last WQHL) so not generic driver. I have tried using older and newer GPU driver and I still get the same result with both methods.

Just to add with method 2 I dont need to disable Spotlights once loading reached 100%. I dont have a spare GPU so I cant try with another hardware.

Thanks

[S_r_d_a_n K_o_s_t_i_c]

2 hours ago, Hendrik said:

ls on core 0. I repeat this method many times and gets a consistent result.

FYI: I reinstalled W10 64bit and did not have any other addons installed and tried both method above. After that I decided to start installing addons and tried the methods above. In both case I get the same result of method 1 and 2.

I hope you understand what I mean. Should I make upload a video?

Regards

 

No, no, I get it, however what I don't get:

Did you get the same problems after you fresh install windows, without anything else but P3D + FSL?

[Hendrik Herryjanto]

I am not oc'ed and I am using AMD so I cant try your suggestion there. Shadercache I tried both ON and OFF , it gives me the same result.

Yes I get the same DXGI error only with only P3D V3.4 HF3 and FSL. I must stress that I only get DXGI error if I enable Spotlights.

[S_r_d_a_n K_o_s_t_i_c]

Ohhh sorry, I totally missed you are having AMD GPU.

Can you please post your specs?

2 minutes ago, Hendrik said:

I am not oc'ed and I am using AMD so I cant try your suggestion there. Shadercache I tried both ON and OFF , it gives me the same result.

Yes I get the same DXGI error only with only P3D V3.4 HF3 and FSL. I must stress that I only get DXGI error if I enable Spotlights.

Yes yes, I get that. The fact is that Spotlights triggers something, and it is general, it is in windows, not in FSL.

You might as well try Windows 7, just for the sakes of it. You really need to start limiting things on the software basis.

[S_r_d_a_n K_o_s_t_i_c]

And btw. that procedure in TM that ai_ab posted, does nothing for me. Not a single FPS, I just checked with fully unlimited frames. However I am using FFTF 0.01, so that might also leverage things differently.

[Hendrik Herryjanto]

7 minutes ago, Kosta said:

And btw. that procedure in TM that ai_ab posted, does nothing for me. Not a single FPS, I just checked with fully unlimited frames. However I am using FFTF 0.01, so that might also leverage things differently.

I on W10 64 bit, i5 6600K, AMD 7870, 16Gb DDR4 2666 Mhz, 2 Samsung Evo 850 both for W10 and P3D, W10 on C: and P3D on D:

That procedure that ai_ab posted I didnt check any improvement on FPS since I am concentrating more on DXGI error. It is interesting that I already set the affinity to all cores but when I load a saved flight on P3D it rely heavily on core 0. When I followed that procedure (which basically just confirming affinity settings) the load is spread on all 4 cores. 

I need to find the time to test W7. That is a big time investment ,

[S_r_d_a_n K_o_s_t_i_c]

Load on Core0 is normal. I have it too, and yet no DXGI.

You shouldn't be using AM at all, really. If you don't want HT, turn it off, and vice versa.

You can't make P3D NOT rely on the first core. And doing that in the task manager does not make a difference, IMO. What you see there is a graphical representation. What is happening underneath, I don't think that changes a thing.

[ai_ab]

Well, setting HT ON with AM=85 I have about the same performance as with HT OFF and no AM. However, in the former case the OS is more responsive.

[S_r_d_a_n K_o_s_t_i_c]

Actually,

I'd like to ask anyone having this problem, to search for nvlddmkm.sys on your whole system partition.
Please report if you have a single file (then check for the version and compare to the driver you *know* you last installed) or you have multiple files.
Thanks

[Bill Barrette]

I am having a big problem lately with this kernelbase.dll issue and the A320. P3D just suddenly hangs with a black screen and I can still hear the flight going on.  Wasn't switching windows or anything at the time, just reading up on this error. I reloaded a flight after it crashed and it crashed again after about 35 min while flying halfway between PKMJ and PHNL over the Pacific, no clouds at all, so no textures and no real weather to speak of.

I have multiple of those files you asked us to look for..  one in system32/drivers (version 21.21.13.7633) and 4 in system32/driverstore/filerepository/nv_.....amd64..../. Funny in that I don't have an amd card. Should I delete those?

w7, 980gtx, p3d 3.4, 176.33, AS16/ASCA, no Orbyx products of any kind, vPilot, no overclocking, no AM, very few cfg tweaks, FSUIPC 4.961 registered, no VAS issues to speak of lately. Spotlights installed. Latest versions of everything except nVidia driver.

What was your thinking asking us to look for that file?

Bill Barrette

 

 

[S_r_d_a_n K_o_s_t_i_c]

This file is a main Nvidia driver file. If you have multiple files, I wouldn't recommend deleting them manually, but rather using DDU to clean up the system in the safe mode (directly selectable from DDU), and making sure that no Nvidia driver is installed when you reboot (check with Device Manager). If it's not, then search for the file, if you have none, good, and then install your driver again.

W7 and W10 handle drivers differently, in which process I am definitely no specialist, but only troubleshooter with experience. I have been reading about multiple files and people solving problems when removed (but not manually deleted, albeit some did that too - no guarantees, as deleting stuff manually *can* potentially do more harm than good).

The reason for looking the file up is because there might be remnants of older drivers, and the best way is to check the versions of those files, especially if there are more.

You should also update your FSUIPC to the latest version: http://forum.simflight.com/topic/80977-updated-modules/

 

[Bill Barrette]

Thanks, I actually have the latest version of FSUIPC.

Can't seem to get anywhere with this kernelbase error lately. 

With your numerous threads and experience with this, is it related to spotlights or to switching ina d out of windowed mode with alt-ent in your opinion.

Bill

[S_r_d_a_n K_o_s_t_i_c]

There are quite many threads on topics of DXGI errors and crashes, yes. Spotlights is a possible trigger, switching alt+enter has some cause, but for me in a mix with the GPU acceleration in Firefox. I haven't had DXGI error since my last 6 flights now, I always either deactivate the GPU acceleration or just minimize Firefox, to avoid it - it doesn't happen even if Firefox is open, not every time.

Besides, I will probably get 3 monitors sometime soon, and will not have to switch any more.

[Bill Barrette]

Is the kernelbase.dll error and the dxgi error the same?  I get both at different times, mostly the kernelbase.dll error lately.

[S_r_d_a_n K_o_s_t_i_c]

I can't say for sure. May be, or at least tied to the same problem. There are things you can try, but all is just trying. And P3D and A320 are not the only programs having such problems.


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[Michael Freeman]

Not sure if this helps - or if a new thread would be better.

My sim is crashing when undocking cockpit view windows and dragging them to monitors driven by another GPU. It tries to render the undocked window before locking up.

If I disable spotlights (and forego the ambient lighting in the a320  ), all works fine. Its replicable everytime

Latest version of p3d academic client, and build 22 spotlights. GFX cards are 770 and 780 with 378.33. Later version of nvidia drive behaves the same.

If you need further details just ask.

Many thanks indeed.

 

[Bill Barrette]

Yeah, I am only having this problem with this A320 seems like. I don't undock windows but do go in and out of full screen to do things like vPilot and AS map and Servinfo, check my VA website etc. No Firefox, just I.E.

Bill Barrette

www.united-virtual.com

[Tobias Schlegel]

So... I got these problems, too... The last answer from FSLabs was "it's not our problem". Fine... I paid over 100 bucks for the A320 and it's not fully working due to Spotlight. What are your next steps?

[Hendrik Herryjanto]

12 hours ago, Tobisky said:

So... I got these problems, too... The last answer from FSLabs was "it's not our problem". Fine... I paid over 100 bucks for the A320 and it's not fully working due to Spotlight. What are your next steps?

I also had that problem too with my old card AMD 7870 and I understand your frustration. Sadly it is true, this problem also occur with PMDG products and other games as well so it is not specifically caused by spotlight. The trigger to this problem varies from PC to PC, there is no permanent solution that works on every PC.

I found a way to work around this problem with my old card. I am using P3D btw, when you loaded your A320X once it reaches 100% quickly go to your add-on tab on the top of the screen and quickly go to Spotlights option and disable it. After the a/c is fully loaded and I usually wait 1 more minute after that, you can enable Spotlight again. When I did that I won't be receiving DXGI error.

Recently I got myself 1070 and did a clean GPU driver cleanup using DDU. Now I dont have that DXGI error anymore. I think P3D4 will eliminate this problem.

[Tobias Schlegel]

Thx for you input... but your way didn't work for me... Even when I reach the Addon-Tab and klick on "disable" suddenly the error occurs... Is there anywhere an older version of spotlight available? Maybe this would work for me.

After deinstall all is working fine, just without the full cockpit lights...

Maybe I have to live with a Addon Aircraft that costs me more than 100 bucks and it's not fully functional. Sad to say that... And maybe this comes from my disappointment... but FSLabs worked on this aircraft for years. After that you need 3!!! installers to have a full working addon. One of it causes problems and even if it's not the problem of the tool itself, the only answer you get is: "it's not our problem". Customer focus normally works vice versa!

[Hendrik Herryjanto]

20 minutes ago, Tobisky said:

Thx for you input... but your way didn't work for me... Even when I reach the Addon-Tab and klick on "disable" suddenly the error occurs... Is there anywhere an older version of spotlight available? Maybe this would work for me.

After deinstall all is working fine, just without the full cockpit lights...

Maybe I have to live with a Addon Aircraft that costs me more than 100 bucks and it's not fully functional. Sad to say that... And maybe this comes from my disappointment... but FSLabs worked on this aircraft for years. After that you need 3!!! installers to have a full working addon. One of it causes problems and even if it's not the problem of the tool itself, the only answer you get is: "it's not our problem". Customer focus normally works vice versa!

Make sure you do it quick enough, before every texture is loaded. If I did it too slow then it won't work. 

I completely understand your frustration however it happens on PMDG products as well and they will tell you the same thing and PMDG cost the same as FSL. It also happened with vanilla P3Dv3 with me and LM can't even help. Rest assure FSL 

http://www.prepar3d.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6312&t=123093&start=165

Rest assure FSL is not neglecting their customers, they simply can't debug the error. Until now no body can.

But I do agree with you, it would be better if FSL can eliminate the use of Spotlight. Until now with my new card (1070) I dont get the error anymore so I am rather happy now.

Can't wait for FSL for P3D4.

[Vitalijus Montrimas]

For me spotlight works on 382.05 driver and crashes on anything above that, you could try downgrading and see if it helps. From what I was reading 382.05 is pretty good driver no leaks or other nonsense.

[Alcides Segovia]

5 hours ago, Vitalijus Montrimas said:

For me spotlight works on 382.05 driver and crashes on anything above that, you could try downgrading and see if it helps. From what I was reading 382.05 is pretty good driver no leaks or other nonsense.

I updated to this driver and all of a sudden have this error. I have never had this problem. Now since installing this driver I cant use the sim unless I make the Spotlight module not load at startup. I am perplexed by this issue as again I never had this problem until now. The interesting thing is that V4 is working fine. Its just 3.4 that is giving me this issue. And I cant go back to 3.3.5 because of the FSDT not supporting them anymore. 

[Alex Ridge]

On 6/17/2017 at 5:40 AM, Alcides Segovia said:

I updated to this driver and all of a sudden have this error. I have never had this problem. Now since installing this driver I cant use the sim unless I make the Spotlight module not load at startup. I am perplexed by this issue as again I never had this problem until now. The interesting thing is that V4 is working fine. Its just 3.4 that is giving me this issue. And I cant go back to 3.3.5 because of the FSDT not supporting them anymore. 

Same

[Lefteris Kalamaras]

On 6/15/2017 at 10:49 PM, Tobisky said:

So... I got these problems, too... The last answer from FSLabs was "it's not our problem". Fine... I paid over 100 bucks for the A320 and it's not fully working due to Spotlight. What are your next steps?

The last answer was not "it's not our problem" exactly - it was "how would we be able to fix something that 1) we don't have the source code for, and 2) exists even when FSLSpotlights is not running / installed".

Do a quick google search for that DXGI issue - it happens everywhere and for lots of DirectX applications - it was introduced with P3D v3.X after 3.3.5 and can occur when the graphics card can not cope with the graphics frame data passed to it.

[S_r_d_a_n K_o_s_t_i_c]

As I just changed my GFX to 1080TI, I am looking forward at maybe (not-)seeing DXGI error. I wonder if that will make a difference. However, I am only on v4 now, so kinda more than one factor here.