Home Joystcick Vs Airbus Sidestick

[Project777 0]

Hi Doug,

well, this is the other side of the coin: what in our hobby is "cheap" today?

I'm in the hobby since the very beginning, but as soon as people noticed that there are lot of simmers out there, the prices went up. Some of them more then twice the old price!

For example: I purchased a 727 throttle quadrant and some other parts 15 years ago. The price?

US$ 500 for the quadrant, $ 300 for the control column, $ 100 for a 727 gear lever. Compare this to the prices form today .. this is what makes me sick And very often, the quality is not meeting the level of price. Also for products of well known vendors.

But this is a topic not to be discussed in this thread.

I'm looking forward to the FSL A 320, to a hopefully affordable price!

Best regards

Hans

[Lefteris Kalamaras 8850]

Hans,

why does it make you sick? When I went to college (graduated 1993), gas prices were $0.99 a gallon. Now? Three times that. It's called inflation. Why would you expect that prices in consumer goods would stay down? Don't we need to pay for gas as well?

[Francois Goudal 0]

Hi,

Do you know if it would be possible to find some kind of 3d model of an airbus sidestick ?

I have access to a bunch of 3d printers, and I would definetely be able to print sidesticks that would certainly cost less than 50 USD (as long as I am not asked to print more than 10 a month, since 3d printings takes a lot of time.)

[Project777 0]

Hi Lefteris,

well, unfortunately everything increases in its price very rapidly, despite our loan. If I would earn three times the money I earned 15 years ago, no discussion here

And 30 years old scraped parts are not worth 5 time the money they cost 15 years ago! That’s not inflation that’s very close to a rip-off.

Anyway: it is as it is, and I’m looking forward to your great Airbus. All I have read in this forum, and all the pic’s I’ve seen makes me waiting eagerly. Especially that you are going to implement a 2D cockpit with undockable PFD / ND etc. is perfect!!

Best wishes to you and your team for 2013!

Regards Hans

[Vonduck 0]

Hi,

Do you know if it would be possible to find some kind of 3d model of an airbus sidestick ?

I have access to a bunch of 3d printers, and I would definetely be able to print sidesticks that would certainly cost less than 50 USD (as long as I am not asked to print more than 10 a month, since 3d printings takes a lot of time.)

Fanwe...gidday! Thanks for chipping in on this discussion!

What exactly do you need? What does a 3D printer do...and how?

Sounds intriguing and with all the good folks out there eagerly wanting side-sticks as well, i am sure we can come up with something!

[Francois Goudal 0]

Fanwe...gidday! Thanks for chipping in on this discussion!

What exactly do you need? What does a 3D printer do...and how?

Sounds intriguing and with all the good folks out there eagerly wanting side-sticks as well, i am sure we can come up with something!

Hi.

Well, basically, 3d printers extrude plastic, and can make parts with almost any kind of shape, even complicated.

As far as I can tell, an airbus sidestick doesn't look too complicated for a 3d printer to make, the only thing it needs is the file to be printed.

The printers would ususally print from an STL file, which is a format that any CAD software is able to export to (Catia, Solidworks, ...). So if you know somebody who would be able to design an airbus sidestick in such a software, or who maybe already has such a file, then I'd be able to give it to one of the printers I have access to in order to make one for real.

[Vonduck 0]

I did some asking form Desert Air Spares in the USA for an old sidestick for low costs... they came back with the cost of $55,000.00 for the unit (has to be complete!)... once i got off the floor i think Routech are the way to go for a sidestick failing the ability to do the 3D moudling etc...

[Philippe Gleize 560]

I asked Routech if they could provide a joystock for a Warthog Base but still no answer. Cockpit Sonic provides also interesting sticks but I read that their delays are sometimes very long... There is also Flightdeck solution but it's a bit expensive

[Project777 0]

Hi,

well, 55k is nothing for us simmers .. but I refuse talking about prices

Did you asked Lausitz Aviation? They happen to have some Airbus parts, as well as some cut off cockpit sections.

See here:

http://www.lausitzav...stribution.html

http://www.lausitzav...tribution2.html

As far as I have heard Routech sticks seems to be good quality, and produced from a mold taken from an genuine 320 stick. We ordered a set, but I've not seen the products until now...

Regards

Hans

[John Barnes 964]

I asked Routech if they could provide a joystock for a Warthog Base but still no answer. Cockpit Sonic provides also interesting sticks but I read that their delays are sometimes very long... There is also Flightdeck solution but it's a bit expensive

The thing about FDS which is why i am going with their products is that they are designed for simulator and cockpit building specific.

nobody said this kind of immersion comes cheap. Take theSaiitek yoke for instance, one product that people use rather than pay high prices for one specific to the airframe they use.

[Flight_1986 2]

Seems to me like we keep hitting dead ends here on this matter. I have been in contact with Gwyn from Aerosim Solutions for a sidestick and I am waiting for a reply. As for the sidestick from FDS that you guys have requested permission to remold, I do not see why you cannot remold it, FDS has discontinued production of that specific model of side stick and if you look at their new stick compared to the old on it look a bit different. Since no company is willing to produce a simple mold like the FDS one, this only leave simmers themselves to do this. I this its BS that a Airbus Sidestick sleeve/mold should cost over $100.00 dollars.

[cpt.ghost24 0]

Seems to me like we keep hitting dead ends here on this matter. I have been in contact with Gwyn from Aerosim Solutions for a sidestick and I am waiting for a reply. As for the sidestick from FDS that you guys have requested permission to remold, I do not see why you cannot remold it, FDS has discontinued production of that specific model of side stick and if you look at their new stick compared to the old on it look a bit different. Since no company is willing to produce a simple mold like the FDS one, this only leave simmers themselves to do this. I this its BS that a Airbus Sidestick sleeve/mold should cost over $100.00 dollars.

yeah i agree that we could mold the FDS sidestick and plus the design is not FDS or any other companies copyright it is Airbus Industrie who owns the rights. So basically I have found a couple of places that could do this whole thing for really really cheap and the labor cost is also peanuts. I would love to be able to get my hands on a mold and then give these out to people who need(unfinished or finished sidesticks) for the bare minimum cost. we could do finished and unfinished ones(Unfinished meaning right out of the mold sandpapered and ready to fix up with the switches and the base, Finished meaning painted and switches connected to a Logitech Extreme 3D Pro). Only thing you'll be paying for is labor and shipping(Extra for the finished of course). Btw I live in Sri Lanka so yeah labor is very cheap. So whoever is interested in sending me a mold let me know then we can start this so whoever is interested can have their sidesticks done by the time FSLabs releases their Bus. This would definitely be a nice addition and I'm sure both versions versions can go for way below the cheapest in the market.

[Vonduck 0]

yeah i agree that we could mold the FDS sidestick and plus the design is not FDS or any other companies copyright it is Airbus Industrie who owns the rights. So basically I have found a couple of places that could do this whole thing for really really cheap and the labor cost is also peanuts. I would love to be able to get my hands on a mold and then give these out to people who need(unfinished or finished sidesticks) for the bare minimum cost. we could do finished and unfinished ones(Unfinished meaning right out of the mold sandpapered and ready to fix up with the switches and the base, Finished meaning painted and switches connected to a Logitech Extreme 3D Pro). Only thing you'll be paying for is labor and shipping(Extra for the finished of course). Btw I live in Sri Lanka so yeah labor is very cheap. So whoever is interested in sending me a mold let me know then we can start this so whoever is interested can have their sidesticks done by the time FSLabs releases their Bus. This would definitely be a nice addition and I'm sure both versions versions can go for way below the cheapest in the market.

Well! This does sound promising... if the mold exists then we may well be in business... i should imagine you will get quite a few expressions of interest in this if it goes ahead... i for one would be most interested in the completed version - as in plug and play!

Good work cpt.ghost24!

[Flight_1986 2]

Guys, there is a simple solution to this. Who ever has a mold can go to local print shop and get the sidestick 3D scanned its cheap. Or even if whoever has the sidestick take 6 photos, left, right, fromt, back, top and bottom and provide dimensions, I can than create a wooden one and create a mold from that and start making resin filled ones.

So whoever has a sidestick please if you can do this for us it would be greatly appreciated.

[Francois Goudal 0]

Guys, there is a simple solution to this. Who ever has a mold can go to local print shop and get the sidestick 3D scanned its cheap. Or even if whoever has the sidestick take 6 photos, left, right, fromt, back, top and bottom and provide dimensions, I can than create a wooden one and create a mold from that and start making resin filled ones.

So whoever has a sidestick please if you can do this for us it would be greatly appreciated.

If someone can 3D scan an existing sidestick, or make one in a 3d modelling software then I'm also interested in the file, because I would then be able to 3D print it. The advantage of 3d prints compared to moulding is that you can more easily make holes going through the part, and if we want to be able to put wires through the sidestick, for the autopilot disable pushbutton for instance, it could be interesting.

[cpt.ghost24 0]

now that you mentioned it, i can do that too. i will look into it but n the mean time we need to locate someone who can send a mold.

[Vonduck 0]

Ill hunt around in NZ to see if anyone can help out here...

[Whatda 0]

Has anyone tried this one

http://www.flightdecksolutions.com/list_products.php?id=%5C

It's only $39.

I received a quote to Australia for $109.

If a few are interested and chip in I don't mind scanning it

And then will have a STL file so we can 3d print it.

[Flight_1986 2]

Has anyone tried this one

http://www.flightdec...oducts.php?id=\

It's only $39.

I received a quote to Australia for $109.

If a few are interested and chip in I don't mind scanning it

And then will have a STL file so we can 3d print it.

FDS does not sell this anymore, I have contacted FDS and no luck, they do not make this anymore since they produce the 1299 Sidestick. Unless they started making it again which i dont see since i just spoke to them 2 weeks ago.

[Whatda 0]

Yep,you're right.

Just received email back from them,

Indicating the same.

The shipping price was for the $1200 unit.DOH!

[Flight_1986 2]

Yep,you're right.

Just received email back from them,

Indicating the same.

The shipping price was for the $1200 unit.DOH!

Yeah it sucks. I am in the hopes of receiving the one from Aerosim when they get to it so bare with me guys soon as I can get it I will let you know and if i get permission from them to reproduce we are good to go. I cannot believe out of how many pilots there are that fly the Airbus that the sim community cannot get more detailed dimensions and such to help us produce the most realistic environment possible.

[Jordan Chin 162]

Hi,

Do you know if it would be possible to find some kind of 3d model of an airbus sidestick ?

I have access to a bunch of 3d printers, and I would definetely be able to print sidesticks that would certainly cost less than 50 USD (as long as I am not asked to print more than 10 a month, since 3d printings takes a lot of time.)

I'd be willing to do up a 3D model. Could anyone provide me with the dimensions so I can do that up?

[Francois Goudal 0]

Sounds great ! I'll go pre-heat my 3d printer then ;-)

I'd be willing to do up a 3D model. Could anyone provide me with the dimensions so I can do that up?

[Vonduck 0]

Looks like things might be happening here! I for one am happy to help out with costs if needed....

[Whatda 0]

I'd be willing to do up a 3D model. Could anyone provide me with the dimensions so I can do that up?

I have some high res photos i recently took , will email them to you and

next time I`m at work will record some dimensions of the side stick.

What modelling software are you using?

[Jordan Chin 162]

I have some high res photos i recently took , will email them to you and

next time I`m at work will record some dimensions of the side stick.

What modelling software are you using?

PM received! I use 3DS Max, but I also have Blender and Maya. Any in particular I should do it in?

[cpt.ghost24 0]

this is lovely please do let me know how i can help.

[Vonduck 0]

this is lovely please do let me know how i can help.

Same here... happy to assist if i can

[Whatda 0]

PM received! I use 3DS Max, but I also have Blender and Maya. Any in particular I should do it in?

As long as you can export it to a .stl file would be great as thats the flavour for most 3d printers.

Also I have just started using inventor and its a very steep leaning curve.

but i managed to 3d print from modeling a set of A330 thrust levers from dimensions i wrote down

the other day.they came out reasonable well, but its still WIP.will be posting these on thingeverse when finished.

i would attach a photo ,but cant seem to find how to do this here?

[Chris Hulme 10]

Hi Guys

New around here, found this post on google after looking for a replica sidesitck!

Anyways, I had the idea of make a 3D model myself and printing it in 3D then discovered you lot had already had that idea and possibly started it? Anyway yesterday at work I took some photos of the sidestick to help me, so thought Id share as im not so good at 3D modeling! All Id ask is that if you use my photos could I have a copy of the 3D model so I can "print" my own out?

Anyway heres a link to the album! If you need any specific angles or measurements let me know and Ill see what I can do!

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v155/ChrisHulme/Sidestick/

Oh and applogises about the quality of a few the cameras not brilliant!

Chris

[Pere Duran 2]

Hi Guys

New around here, found this post on google after looking for a replica sidesitck!

Anyways, I had the idea of make a 3D model myself and printing it in 3D then discovered you lot had already had that idea and possibly started it? Anyway yesterday at work I took some photos of the sidestick to help me, so thought Id share as im not so good at 3D modeling! All Id ask is that if you use my photos could I have a copy of the 3D model so I can "print" my own out?

Anyway heres a link to the album! If you need any specific angles or measurements let me know and Ill see what I can do!

http://smg.photobuck...ulme/Sidestick/

Oh and applogises about the quality of a few the cameras not brilliant!

Chris

Amazing pictures! But easyJet A320 with SATCOM?

[Chris Hulme 10]

Amazing pictures! But easyJet A320 with SATCOM?

Yes, I believe they are fitting them to all of our aircraft but dont use them yet? I was told its because ATC are going digital or something?

[Bus_Driver 12]

ATC are not going digital at least not for a long while anyway! VDL has only been rolled out at some stations not all (VHF Digital Data Link) easyJet's fit of communications equipment is not the same across all the fleet (differing between the A319 and A320) that is why the A320 can take a different route to Iceland than the A319 (MNPS Airspace) All easyJet aircraft are VHF ACARS equipped, with AOC, ATC and wind / flight plan uplink functions. ACARS is now the mainstay way of communicating with their OCC at Luton since the removal of the company VHF channel there.... Otherwise it would be telephone patch via Stockholm radio

[Jordan Chin 162]

As long as you can export it to a .stl file would be great as thats the flavour for most 3d printers.

Also I have just started using inventor and its a very steep leaning curve.

but i managed to 3d print from modeling a set of A330 thrust levers from dimensions i wrote down

the other day.they came out reasonable well, but its still WIP.will be posting these on thingeverse when finished.

i would attach a photo ,but cant seem to find how to do this here?

Ok great, I can use either programs then since all can export to stl!

Hi Guys

New around here, found this post on google after looking for a replica sidesitck!

Anyways, I had the idea of make a 3D model myself and printing it in 3D then discovered you lot had already had that idea and possibly started it? Anyway yesterday at work I took some photos of the sidestick to help me, so thought Id share as im not so good at 3D modeling! All Id ask is that if you use my photos could I have a copy of the 3D model so I can "print" my own out?

Anyway heres a link to the album! If you need any specific angles or measurements let me know and Ill see what I can do!

http://smg.photobuck...ulme/Sidestick/

Oh and applogises about the quality of a few the cameras not brilliant!

Chris

Thanks for the shots, these will help me greatly too!

[Chris Hulme 10]

ATC are not going digital at least not for a long while anyway! VDL has only been rolled out at some stations not all (VHF Digital Data Link) easyJet's fit of communications equipment is not the same across all the fleet (differing between the A319 and A320) that is why the A320 can take a different route to Iceland than the A319 (MNPS Airspace) All easyJet aircraft are VHF ACARS equipped, with AOC, ATC and wind / flight plan uplink functions. ACARS is now the mainstay way of communicating with their OCC at Luton since the removal of the company VHF channel there.... Otherwise it would be telephone patch via Stockholm radio

Ah right fair enough, although they normally say No Data Link or something like that so dont really know much about them, it was a while ago when I asked!

We did the LPL-FUE last night and went over spain, portugal then towards the canaries, but I know sometimes we take the T9 route and I believe thats A320 only? (correct me if thats wrong but its something like that)

Thanks for the shots, these will help me greatly too!

No probs, if you need any specific angles or anything let me know and Ill see what I can do!

[Bus_Driver 12]

Are you talking about the CPDLC? In which case quite often they would not be connected to an ATC unit and as such it would display that message....

HF Radio Requirements

Atlantic routes generally require two HF for ATC communication. However, certain approved routes may be flown with single HF radios. Refer to the AT(H/L)

chart for further information.

VHF and HF With Reykjavik OCA

Direct VHF communications with Reykjavik Control is available when traversing the airspace East of 30°W and South of 68°N. See AT(H/L) 1/2 chart for

frequencies.

SELCAL

SELCAL watch on the HF or VHF frequencies assigned for ATC communications is available.

Datalink

ACARS communications via VHF datalink ACARS is available continuously in

Atlantic airspace on easyJet approved routes.

HF Radio Requirements

Atlantic routes generally require two HF for ATC communication. However, certain approved routes may be flown with single HF radios. Refer to the AT(H/L)

chart for further information.

VHF and HF With Reykjavik OCA

Direct VHF communications with Reykjavik Control is available when traversing the airspace East of 30°W and South of 68°N. See AT(H/L) 1/2 chart for

frequencies.

SELCAL

SELCAL watch on the HF or VHF frequencies assigned for ATC communications is available.

Datalink

ACARS communications via VHF datalink ACARS is available continuously in

Atlantic airspace on easyJet approved routes.

INTRODUCTION

Most of the oceanic airspace in the North Atlantic region is designated as MNPS (Minimum Navigational

Performance Specification) between FL285 and FL420. Additionally, this airspace is RVSM airspace.

Most routes in MNPS airspace require the carriage of 2 HF radios. easyJet A320 aircraft have only 1 HF

radio and are permitted to operate on certain routes on which VHF coverage exists but where 1 HF radio is

required as a back-up (e.g. in case of gaps in VHF coverage.) easyJet A319 and A320 aircraft are also

both approved for MNPS along a very limited number of routes where only VHF radio is required.

Note:

The requirement to remain within 1 hour single engine flight time from a useable airfield still exists in

MNPS airspace. (approx 380nm for A319 and approx 400nms for A320 - these represent the

maximum allowable distance from a useable airport for flight planning and operational purposes and

must be adhered to. Only in the event of airborne emergency may a flight exceed these distances.)

Note: For the purposes of this rule, a useable airport is defined as an appropriate runway,

navigations, communications and emergency facilities available as defined in OM A.

The Jeppesen Text Manual ATC section, AT pages (Atlantic) can be referred to for details of

operation in North Atlantic Oceanic airspace

This guide covers only briefly covers the most commonly used routes, however, other approved routes may

be used from time to time and the procedures for such routes are similar to those described below.

Further details of these routes and full MNPS procedures can be found in OMC 11.2.3

The most commonly used route to Spain and the Canary Islands is Tango 9 (T9) which runs each way

between LASNO (a point South of Cork & West of Brest) and BEGAS (a point North of La Coruna, Spain).

It avoids French Airspace and is under the control of SHANWICK OCEANIC CONTROL AREA (OCA):

OPERATION TO ICELAND (A319 NON-HF)

easyJet has MNPS approval for the A319 to operate on specified routes that do not require HF. For

operation to Keflavik this will be:

Stornoway/Benbecula - 61ºN 10ºW [RATSU] - ALDAN – KEF

KEF - 61ºN 10ºW [RATSU] – Stornoway/Benbecula (FL310 and above for VHF coverage)

CHECK OFP CAREFULLY BEFORE DISPATCH THAT ROUTING IS COMPATIBLE WITH

COMMUNICATION EQUIPMENT (A319 OR A320)

Standard MNPS Oceanic procedures and contingencies apply (refer to OMC 11.2.5 and OMC 11.2.6) with

the following differences:

Normally in North Atlantic Oceanic airspace, retain the last assigned squawk for 30 minutes after

entering the OCA and then set transponder code 2000. Reykjavik OCA has a difference – retain

the assigned transponder code until advised by ATC (Reykjavik ATC provides Radar Control

Service in the south-eastern part of its area).

Seek clearance at least 20 minutes before Oceanic entry point. If unable to contact Iceland Radio

on VHF (or HF if applicable), request the ATC authority for the current airspace to relay the request

for Oceanic Clearance to Reykjavík Centre. If unable to obtain Oceanic Clearance prior to entry into

the Reykjavik CTA, seek confirmation of authorisation to enter Reykjavik airspace from the current

ATS unit. Having received such a confirmation, enter Reykjavik airspace at the level cleared by that

unit and continue attempts to obtain the Oceanic Clearance.

For non-HF operation, use VHF1 for the appropriate ATC frequency and VHF2 to monitor 121.5 in

the OCA. The additional use of 123.45 can be considered if necessary.

easyJet A320 aircraft can operate on additional routes to/from KEF where only 1 HF radio is

required.

Note that EGPO, EGPD and BIKF are useful airfields to consider for the requirement to remain

within 1 hour single engine flight time of a useable airfield.

[Chris Hulme 10]

Are you talking about the CPDLC? In which case quite often they would not be connected to an ATC unit and as such it would display that message....

Im refering to the screens that have been installed next to the lower ECAM below the backup VOR/ADF

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v155/ChrisHulme/Sidestick/DSCF1170_zps6ee97e7f.jpg

You can just about see it in the background on here!

And thanks for the other info, I take it thats one of the guides from inside?

[Bus_Driver 12]

Yeah that's for the CPDLC (Controller Pilot Data Link Communication) if they are connected to an ATC unit then you will see information displayed on that unit, otherwise not

[Jordan Chin 162]

No probs, if you need any specific angles or anything let me know and Ill see what I can do!

Was just gonna ask about the angle of the stick. I'm sure you or Whatda will help me with that .

[Francois Goudal 0]

Amazing pictures! But easyJet A320 with SATCOM?

Isn't this in order to get prepared for the switch from Air traffic control to Air traffic management in Europe ? ( ADS-B )

[Francois Goudal 0]

As long as you can export it to a .stl file would be great as thats the flavour for most 3d printers.

Also I have just started using inventor and its a very steep leaning curve.

but i managed to 3d print from modeling a set of A330 thrust levers from dimensions i wrote down

the other day.they came out reasonable well, but its still WIP.will be posting these on thingeverse when finished.

i would attach a photo ,but cant seem to find how to do this here?

Hi !

Would you mind sharing your STLs for the thrust levers ? I'd be greatly interested actually.

[Bus_Driver 12]

Isn't this in order to get prepared for the switch from Air traffic control to Air traffic management in Europe ? ( ADS-B )

Nope ADS-B has nothing to do with SATCOM, for ADS-B you need a GPS and a modified mode S transponder. This is transmitting data on 1090 MHZ, this allows for all of the various functions that can be brought about with this technology.. Such as clearances for us to follow the leader etc

[cpt.ghost24 0]

Im refering to the screens that have been installed next to the lower ECAM below the backup VOR/ADF

http://img.photobuck...zps6ee97e7f.jpg

You can just about see it in the background on here!

And thanks for the other info, I take it thats one of the guides from inside?

the screen fitted below the lower ecam is called ATSU if i'm not mistaken?

[cpt.ghost24 0]

and yeah i would love the STI file so i can try and print it here. Might be able to do it for real cheap we just have to try. nice going guys KUDOS!

[Whatda 0]

Hi !

Would you mind sharing your STLs for the thrust levers ? I'd be greatly interested actually.

They are still a work in progress .

But as soon as I finish them i will upload the stl files to thingeverse.

Im trying to find away to position a pot in the reverser lever ,

shouldnt be to hard ,just need the time.

the main thrust lever is already done with a potentiometer installed.

heres a couple of pic`s I took of what I have constructed.(luv this 3d printer)

all prints done on Makerbot replicator2 at low res.

http://i973.photobucket.com/albums/ae214/grwx2/T1.jpg

http://i973.photobucket.com/albums/ae214/grwx2/T2.jpg

MCDU keypad and frame next.