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Out of the loop - Which simulator will the new Concorde be created for?


James Burke

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Callum McLoughlin

I am sure once the detractors see it, they will hand over the cash and upgrade. I am looking forward to seeing the VC and aircraft in action, though I suspect the VATSIM AAIB will be run off their feet in the first few weeks of launching.

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Callum McLoughlin

Here’s a new question for Andy…

Will the INS work in the same way as last time, with the ‘card loader’, or will it work the same way as the RW BA Concorde which had a different system to calling up cards from the memory?

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45 minutes ago, Callum McLoughlin said:

Here’s a new question for Andy…

Will the INS work in the same way as last time, with the ‘card loader’, or will it work the same way as the RW BA Concorde which had a different system to calling up cards from the memory?

Hi Callum, 

This is an area that has received a lot of attention - it now works just like the real thing did, with FPS and DME memory modules. Following real world procedures, it is now possible to switch between memory modules, and load FPS/DME catalogues through the CDU's. We've updated the 2003 INS database for current AIRAC, with revised routes - each one has been carefully reworked using input from ex-crews and present-day air traffic controllers. A lot of effort has gone into this area of the product. 

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Andrew,

How does this memory module thing work for user-generated flight plans? Currently, I use PFPX to create my own and export them as standard XML FSX plans. I then generate the ADEU files using CPS-X. I trust you’ll be creating something that allows us to generate plans that are compatible with your new system.

Will the new database be able to receive updates from Navigraph AIRAC releases?

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13 hours ago, Callum McLoughlin said:

I am sure once the detractors see it, they will hand over the cash and upgrade. I am looking forward to seeing the VC and aircraft in action, though I suspect the VATSIM AAIB will be run off their feet in the first few weeks of launching.

'detractors', mustn't have any of those now must we (cancel culture at its best)....this detractor will not be handing over any cash, I mean just look at the latest Navigraph survey...P3D ain't doing so well; is it.  Nah I'll wait until FSL produce a Concorde for Msfs. Should I live that long!

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Morning Ray,

We have built our own Concorde Route Planner. CPS was built to be used with Concorde-X, and because the weight and balance model has been completely re-worked to mirror that of the real aircraft, we had to devise our own system. In fact, each Concorde airframe has been individually setup with exact figures. Some are heavier, some are lighter. You can now add any amount of payload to any of the holds/cabin areas - plus fuel - and the resulting CG will match what was seen on the real aircraft. 

It was important to set the weight and balance model up correctly, because it played a vital role in the fuel planning - specifically for calculating the fuel balance required for the takeoff (pre-takeoff transfer/burn off), 59% CG in cruise and a 53.5% CG for landing. The system would then work out if any extra (ballast) fuel was needed to be carried. 

Our planning system handles schedule/charter and custom routes. Any custom routes are exported to a custom route memory module database - and this can easily be selected through the INS CDU. The planning system then carries out complex calculation routines to build a complete fuel/route/weather and tactical briefing - a 25 page document set out (to the letter) per the real paperwork that the crews took onboard. All of this data is synced to the simulator - and you then run through the pre-departure flows whilst the aircraft is loaded and fueled to these pre-calculated figures (a similar experience to that which our Airbus customers are familiar with).

It's an extremely complex system that we've made simple and easy to use.

8 hours ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Will the new database be able to receive updates from Navigraph AIRAC releases?

Yes, much the same as our Airbus series - the Concorde system will reference the same AIRAC cycle that is installed for FSLabs, whether that be the default cycle that we ship with our products, or a more recent cycle for those users who have a subscription to one of the AIRAC providers. 

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Hi Andrew.

Thanks for the explanation as to how the system will work. No chance of any screenshots in a Concorde Preview section on your website I suppose. ;)

It sounds like you have transformed the planning process. We'll be able to fly our Concorde of choice and to and from any airport in the world. Great stuff!

And I trust when you save a scenario all the settings are 'remembered'?

Regarding weather - will it require ASP3D? I imagine so. Any other 3rd party software required to get the best out of her? Thinking of FSL Spotlights so we can finally fly after dusk.

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2 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

No chance of any screenshots in a Concorde Preview section on your website I suppose. ;)

It sounds like you have transformed the planning process. We'll be able to fly our Concorde of choice and to and from any airport in the world. Great stuff!

And I trust when you save a scenario all the settings are 'remembered'?

Regarding weather - will it require ASP3D? I imagine so. Any other 3rd party software required to get the best out of her? Thinking of FSL Spotlights so we can finally fly after dusk.

Yes, just like the Airbus - you can save/reload the flights with all planning data retained. 

We do integrate with ASP3D - for planning and for the new RDR-4B; a superb addition and great fun to use, especially whilst blasting down the Adriatic at Mach 2 and seeing the boot of Italy mapped out on the ground returns. Spotlights form part of our base/library install through FSL CC - I don't believe we have any other dependencies at this time. 

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I take it the RDR-4B unit is ground radar. Or weather radar too? Never heard of it. Integrated into the VC or a standalone exe?

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Just now, Ray Proudfoot said:

I take it the RDR-4B unit is ground radar. Or weather radar too? Never heard of it. Integrated into the VC or a standalone exe?

It is the weather radar system - it was also used by the crews to display ground returns to aid in situational awareness (you'll have seen Dave on the ITVV DVD drawing out Long Island as they approach JFK). The RDR-4B units were installed on the fleet a couple of years before retirement. Our system is fully integrated - even into the INS for radar beam angle computations :)

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Yes, I remember that video. You're really pushing the boat out which is great. Has a price been determined yet? I know Lefteris asked us many moons ago in a survey and it was around 120GBP or so.

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55 minutes ago, Lefteris Kalamaras said:

As always, it's our policy not to discuss pricing before we release a product.

Some might appreciate a min-max range so they can start saving. ;)

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2 minutes ago, Lefteris Kalamaras said:

Absolutely! It will be between 1 and 9999 us dollars, depending on the exchange rates! emoji16.pngemoji12.png

Sent from my LE2123 using Tapatalk
 

I asked for that! :D

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Callum McLoughlin
19 hours ago, Andrew Wilson said:

Hi Callum, 

This is an area that has received a lot of attention - it now works just like the real thing did, with FPS and DME memory modules. Following real world procedures, it is now possible to switch between memory modules, and load FPS/DME catalogues through the CDU's. We've updated the 2003 INS database for current AIRAC, with revised routes - each one has been carefully reworked using input from ex-crews and present-day air traffic controllers. A lot of effort has gone into this area of the product. 

Hi Andrew

Thank you for answering my question so fully, I really appreciate it. It sounds like a fantastic development, I will be very pleased to see the back of the old INS module which I found to be a bit buggy (maybe it was just me!). 

I could ask so many questions, but I will chance my arm with one more if I may?

Given the level of detail in the A320s, will this one be so faithful to the real aircraft as to simulate minor things, to think of one example the overheating (and subsequent death!) of landing lights being left switched on for too long on the ground at low speeds due to lack of cooling airflow. I seem to remember the under wing ones were particularly prone to this, hence most of the time not bothering and just using taxi/turns? Another example may be tyre management, given the extreme conditions they operated in and potential for scrubbing. Maybe looking for scrubbed or gouged tyres will be a key area to look at either on a walk around in-sim, or on ‘system health’ menus? :P

Sorry… I have one more, I cannot help myself. VATSIM’s new AFV clients (I think… but I could be wrong!!!) may(?) have some ability to cater for HF frequencies. Is this something you have any thoughts on? I am not sure other addons have the ability to wire into that radio band.

Now… I have a legitimate reason to binge on the ITVV videos again, I have held back re-watching them for so long as I always had to suppress the desire to fly her in-sim. 

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Callum McLoughlin
7 hours ago, Steve Prowse said:

'detractors', mustn't have any of those now must we (cancel culture at its best)....this detractor will not be handing over any cash, I mean just look at the latest Navigraph survey...P3D ain't doing so well; is it.  Nah I'll wait until FSL produce a Concorde for Msfs. Should I live that long!

I think you are self-cancelling, rather than anyone else doing it, Steve :P 

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VATSIM’s new AFV clients may(?) have some ability to cater for HF frequencies. Is this something you have any thoughts on?


Hi Callum,

Yes we are in discussion with the devs at Vatsim about this. At the moment it is not supported, but they are keen to put something in place for us to use.

We do have a fully integrated SELCAL system now. We’ve been using this quite a lot during our testing when crossing the North Atlantic. I love hearing the different tones depending on which airframe you’re in
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On 1/14/2022 at 10:34 AM, Andrew Wilson said:

.....

It's an extremely complex system that we've made simple and easy to use.

Yes, much the same as our Airbus series - the Concorde system will reference the same AIRAC cycle that is installed for FSLabs, whether that be the default cycle that we ship with our products, or a more recent cycle for those users who have a subscription to one of the AIRAC providers. 

Hmmmm - never thought I would contemplate this (as I'm firmly committed to MSFS by now), but you've definitely caught my attention with your last posts, so - I might eventually install P3D just for the Concorde ;-)

 

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Michele Benedetti

OOOO Andrew you're teasing us so much. Can't wait for the Concorde X V2. Easily my most anticipated add-on in 2022 :):):). Especially the news regarding the INS and the flightplanner are welcome ones! 

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Especially the news regarding the INS
Yes as I said earlier, a lot of work has gone into the INS. It has really been very interesting re-producing the routes in so much detail and discovering where more attention was needed on our model. For example, a lot of research went into the London Bahrain route. We had data from ex-crews explaining certain characteristics of this scheduled flight that British Airways flew three times a week in the late 70's and early 80's. The crew reports suggested we cross Tripoli a little over 57,000ft. We were initially struggling to cross Tripoli much above 54,000ft with our model (though we knew the cruise climb performance was spot on from our trials on JFK/BGI runs). What later transpired was that our INS wasn't flying supersonic turns correctly. This discrepancy was causing the aircraft to use too much bank and loose altitude at every turn point. After reworking the supersonic control loops in the INS, the aircraft flew the supersonic sector down the Adriatic and Mediterranean Sea with a much smaller bank angle applied throughout the duration of the cruise climb - flying a series of long, smooth winding turns down towards Tripoli. As a result - the aircraft crossed Tripoli at 57,200ft. We were quite impressed 
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Michele Benedetti
On 1/16/2022 at 10:30 AM, Andrew Wilson said:

Yes as I said earlier, a lot of work has gone into the INS. It has really been very interesting re-producing the routes in so much detail and discovering where more attention was needed on our model. For example, a lot of research went into the London Bahrain route. We had data from ex-crews explaining certain characteristics of this scheduled flight that British Airways flew three times a week in the late 70's and early 80's. The crew reports suggested we cross Tripoli a little over 57,000ft. We were initially struggling to cross Tripoli much above 54,000ft with our model (though we knew the cruise climb performance was spot on from our trials on JFK/BGI runs). What later transpired was that our INS wasn't flying supersonic turns correctly. This discrepancy was causing the aircraft to use too much bank and loose altitude at every turn point. After reworking the supersonic control loops in the INS, the aircraft flew the supersonic sector down the Adriatic and Mediterranean Sea with a much smaller bank angle applied throughout the duration of the cruise climb - flying a series of long, smooth winding turns down towards Tripoli. As a result - the aircraft crossed Tripoli at 57,200ft. We were quite impressed emoji4.png

Impressive indeed! May I ask however, you mentioned that you modeled every airframe with their own differences, how would this work with custom liveries? Would there be a "standard airframe specification" which would be the one used for custom liveries or will we be allowed to choose on which airframe paint our livery? Can't wait for this beauty!!! :):):)

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Andrew Wilson
1 hour ago, Michele Benedetti said:

Impressive indeed! May I ask however, you mentioned that you modeled every airframe with their own differences, how would this work with custom liveries? Would there be a "standard airframe specification" which would be the one used for custom liveries or will we be allowed to choose on which airframe paint our livery? Can't wait for this beauty!!! :):):)

Hi Michele, 

Any custom livery would be based on one of the Concorde airframes - just as was done in real life. 

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Martin Richards

Just wanted to voice my appreciation at the level of work that has been going into this.

It's a shame that it wasn't practical to support v4 as well as v5 but I guess I now feel rather vindicated in my decision to move to v5 last year meaning I've managed to move through most of the teething problems now.

I've been itching to fly supersonically again for a while so I look forward to release!

Kind Regards,

Martin

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