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Flight planning with Concorde V2


Michele Benedetti

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Michele Benedetti

Hi!

I was wondering (feel free to correct me if I'm wrong about this), the old Concorde-X used the Delco Carousel CIVA INS to navigate, however this is not compatible and/or working in P3D v5. Does that mean that the new Concorde will have a new INS system (maybe developed entirely by FsLabs)? If it was like that, could we expect some kind of planning tool (like a Simbrief tool for the A32X-X series) for this new Concorde? I think it would be extremely useful since Simbrief and PFPX do not natively support Concorde and is really tedious to plan a flight with these 2 platforms (especially with simbrief). Obviously I'm not writing this to know something from the FsLabs team, I'd rather want to know what are the opinions of the current Concorde X users on this topic, given its importance :):):)

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Michele Benedetti

I know about the Concorde profiles for PFPX however planning things like acceleration/deceleration points etc. is a little bit difficult in PFPX (and Simbrief is even worse). :):):)

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Fraser Gale

Depends how accurate you want your planning to be I guess.  If you like filling in fuel at each waypoint and fuel remaining etc then I agree that PFPX isn't for you.  

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Ray Proudfoot
On 7/22/2021 at 5:19 PM, Michele Benedetti said:

I'd rather want to know what are the opinions of the current Concorde X users on this topic, given its importance.

Unless they change the current method of using xml files for pax and fuel loading I intend to continue using Concorde Performance System X combined with Active Sky 16.

Why fix something that isn’t broken? ;)

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Norman Blackburn
7 hours ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Unless they change the current method of using xml files for pax and fuel loading I intend to continue using Concorde Performance System X combined with Active Sky 16.

Why fix something that isn’t broken? ;)

You will need to change your weather engine as AS16 doesn’t work with P3Dv4/5.  From their downloads page:

Active Sky 2016

AS16 for P3D is NOT COMPATIBLE with P3Dv4.  See ASP4 for P3Dv4 compatibility.

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Michele Benedetti
8 hours ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Unless they change the current method of using xml files for pax and fuel loading I intend to continue using Concorde Performance System X combined with Active Sky 16.

Why fix something that isn’t broken? ;)

But CPS-X is not supported anymore and has some bugs...the flight map for example. I think it would be better for FsLabs to develop a planning tool for flight and performance planning. Obviously this is only my opinion. :)

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Ray Proudfoot
2 hours ago, Norman Blackburn said:

You will need to change your weather engine as AS16 doesn’t work with P3Dv4/5.  From their downloads page:

Active Sky 2016

AS16 for P3D is NOT COMPATIBLE with P3Dv4.  See ASP4 for P3Dv4 compatibility.

I know that Norman. I have ASP3D which I use for v5 and retain AS16 purely for Concorde flights.

I suspect CPS-X won’t be compatible with ASP3D but that’s no problem because all I’m using it for is to get the weather so AS16 is fine for that.

1 hour ago, Michele Benedetti said:

But CPS-X is not supported anymore and has some bugs...the flight map for example. I think it would be better for FsLabs to develop a planning tool for flight and performance planning. Obviously this is only my opinion. :)

The flight map works. Been using it for ages. I’ve not found any other bugs. That’s with AS16, I don’t use the default wx option.

CPS-X is extraordinarily sophisticated and I doubt FSL will develop anything close to it. The only downside to using it is the interface is very small on a 4K screen so I have to switch to 1920*1080 to use it.

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Fraser Gale

The sophistication required to simulate the aircraft in the first place (in my opinion) shows that if they chose to, FSLabs would be more than capable of providing all that you desire and probably more in fact.  Now whether they will is up to them.

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Michele Benedetti

I agree. If FsLabs develop the aircraft itself, no one better than them can develop such a planning tool. I loved using cps-X but it's showing the signs of ageing. And, again, it is very clunky to use! You have to plan the route via another application, then export it as a CIVA file and then you can import it into CPS-X. I think it would be much better to have a single, comprehensive tool that lets you do everything. But again this is only my opinion, the important thing is that FsLabs are developing the Concorde V2 :) :) :)

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Ray Proudfoot
14 minutes ago, Michele Benedetti said:

You have to plan the route via another application, then export it as a CIVA file and then you can import it into CPS-X.

I generate a standard xml flight plan in PFPX and that can be processed by CPS-X. Alternatively, you could plan the flight in P3D and save the plan. Providing it's in XML format there's not a problem.

It's not necessary to create CIVA files for CPS-X. It creates its own.

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Fraser Gale

CPS-X is a good tool and I say that when I never use it!  I do think it has little foibles that I noticed when I tried it out but I can't remember what they were to be honest.  It is a two step process: route from somewhere else - fuel plan in CPS. 

Concorde fuel planning is/was something of a mysterious art that is very difficult to do accurately and even the real world computer program that came from BAC wasn't always perfectly accurate.  Flightsimmers are used to fuel plans being accurate to within a few hundred Kilos on subsonic jets but this wasn't always the case on Concorde. 

It is an each to their own situation again. 

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Fraser Gale

@Michele Benedetti if you would like to try fuel planning "in the raw" then here is a link to my fuel planning program: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1nuM8l3wZdCb74bkWbWA_rGZIFLpyMAed?usp=sharing

I don't normally share this stuff publicly because folk will either complain that it isn't what they like or how it should be done but it might be interesting for you.  Download the folder (you must keep all the exe's in the same folder) and double click the "INDEX500.EXE" to run, then select number 2 on the list.  Note the other options in the index won't work as I've only shared the fuel planning options.  

You can choose to plan using lat/long points, total route length or one of the standard routes.  Make sure you set Caps Lock to on and enjoy - it makes you think about the route you are about to fly in far more depth than any of the flight planning tools around!

Anyone is allowed to try it out but rights reserved by me and no complaining! :D

Fraser

 

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  • 2 weeks later...
Steve Prowse
18 hours ago, Andrew Wilson said:

CPS-X will not be required. 

It will be for some of us....waiting for the MSFS version....we all have to have hope guys....:)

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Fraser Gale
12 hours ago, Steve Prowse said:

It will be for some of us....waiting for the MSFS version....we all have to have hope guys....:)

In what way?  I might be misunderstanding your comment but do you mean you won’t now be buying the new version of Concorde unless it’s for MSFS?

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Steve Prowse
12 hours ago, Fraser Gale said:

In what way?  I might be misunderstanding your comment but do you mean you won’t now be buying the new version of Concorde unless it’s for MSFS?

Well,  yes Frazz I'm going to wait until FSL's Concorde V2 is  MSFS compatible. I'll carry on using FSX until then. I feel FSL will inevitably make all their aircraft MSFS compatible.

All the best

Stay safe and well

Steve

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