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Jon Skiffington

Malware in installer?

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Chris Kreuzbichler

Can't we do it like this, then?

Those who are upset/mad can try to get a refund whatsoever and not come back here anymore. Those who will still purchase products and don't mind having malware temporarily placed on ones pc (me included) may stay here and wait for FSLs next moves. It's 3 am now and I am tired and don't plan on answering any more quotes in the enar future. To me, that suggestion is logical with my still somewhat workign brain and would make things easier.

That being said, good night.

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Marc Ehnle

- probably not completely correct -

Edited by Marc Ehnle
corrections via PM
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Jouka Ahponen
4 minutes ago, Marc Ehnle said:

Guys... why do you think every second developer (not only Flightsim addons) asks you to turn off your anti virus? What FSL did is absolutely common. Totally normal, you accept this every time you run installers that ask you to turn off your AV. This is a big topic now because an obvious pirate (or user of pirated software) complained on reddit... Normally nobody cares about just that common practise...

Well. We cannot tell here about every single developer what they do and what they don't because we have no prove. The thing is, developers say that it is completely safe and this is "false positive" even though in fact they put a malware on your system that the antivirus is trying to warn us about. It's one big lie. And now as it has come into sunlight I am pretty sure that people will think twice before disabling their antivirus and actually asking more answers about it than just "it's false positive".

And if I am completely honest. I have only seen flightsim software to have this "disable antivirus" trend. Any other software I install doesn't have false warnings because it would be bad PR for them to have any of their installers to give out a virus warning. Generally in gaming communities people are more open to disable it, but outside it people are not. And this will probably change the way fs community thinks as well.

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Ian Griffith
2 minutes ago, Marc Ehnle said:

Guys... why do you think every second developer (not only Flightsim addons) asks you to turn off your anti virus? What FSL did is absolutely common. Totally normal, you accept this every time you run installers that ask you to turn off your AV. This is a big topic now because an obvious pirate (or user of pirated software) complained on reddit... Normally nobody cares about just that common practise...

It's because sometimes antivirus erroneously flags that installers that contain no potentially malicious software. The difference in this situation is that the installer DOES carry potentially malicious software.

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Marc Ehnle
8 minutes ago, Jouka Ahponen said:

Well. We cannot tell here about every single developer what they do and what they don't because we have no prove. The thing is, developers say that it is completely safe and this is "false positive" even though in fact they put a malware on your system that the antivirus is trying to warn us about. It's one big lie. And now as it has come into sunlight I am pretty sure that people will think twice before disabling their antivirus and actually asking more answers about it than just "it's false positive".

And if I am completely honest. I have only seen flightsim software to have this "disable antivirus" trend. Any other software I install doesn't have false warnings because it would be bad PR for them to have any of their installers to give out a virus warning. Generally in gaming communities people are more open to disable it, but outside it people are not. And this will probably change the way fs community thinks as well.

possible...

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CristianLundin

Dear FSLabs forum participators,

1. I have installed every possible option and update since day one of the A320. Nothing has happened to my computer nor have my passwords gone astray. One time on Facebook however I accidentally clicked on a picture of sunglasses in a message from a friend - all of a sudden my password and my profile was hijacked. Instead of drama queening on internet forums, I changed my passwords and logged the user out. That was that. 30 minuters of frustration. I did not contact the police, I did not call my MP and I did not mail the King of Sweden calling out the dangers of Facebook.

2. I actually installed the new bus and P3DV4.2 today. When it comes to computer I have no skill, zero. I can hardly type without watching the keyboard. Yet I did manage to install everything in less than 30 minutes and thanks to all the support tickets and how to-guides in these forums, I made everything without a glitch, performance is incredible, the new looks are amazing and the small flaws in the cockpit are gone, and now i fly a very stable product.

3. I have stated many times how much I love this product, not just because of realism but also because the hard work that the developers put in as to further develop it. Not only did I love the product, but I really loved reading the forums with all the how to guides, and threads how not to break it and just felt amazed about the sheer knowledge that this community has to offer. But reading all this horrible negativity against these developers makes me sick, the general bitchie-ness on these forums have turned in to a play ground outside of a kindergarten. This will be the last time I browse through these forums until next software update, because I have just had it with this community. One million posts mumbling the same topic over and over? It's just unbearable. Chill the F down.  

Dev team, please have a beer or five, turn your cell phones off and go on holiday for a week - you do deserve it. I look forward to coming back to this forum when news hit that you are releasing the A319.

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Roman Yar
2 hours ago, Lefteris Kalamaras said:

You're absolutely NOT affected at all. As I repeated before, there is nothing happening UNLESS your serial number has been verified to be a pirate serial number.

How can you GUARANTEE that? How can you prove there are no programming errors in your installer code and your installer just doesn't accidentally run the tool? Likely I store all my passwords elsewhere but your behavior (as software developers) is rude and childish. And one more question - if I no longer trust you am I eligible for refund?

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Aidan Hutchison

I do not expect any form of compensation, however I do expect a new installer free of test.exe and any other malicious software. Hopefully this is a lesson learned. Fire is not to be fought with fire.

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flightsimandy
2 hours ago, DeanJohnston2717 said:

Go run a malware finder program , you’ll find nothing , your doubting something that’s won’t affect you in any way 

that is not the point the fact it even enters your  pc even for a split second without knowledge is where it becomes an issue. Is a legal issue ? maybe maybe not im sure a few will try   but it does make you  question the trustworthy side of it !!.....Anyway if they know what these codes are why not  just block them? after all  we need a connection to verify the product that way there is no need to  do things like this 

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Alexander Luzajic

With that you should lock the thread......I think that would make sense. Thank you

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Lucaat

The approach on this issue this evening was like -4000fpm with no speedbrakes but at the last second the touchdown was kinda -250 ish. Im satisfied & good night :D

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watermelonkiller

Well, hope this will not giving chance to malicious people.

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Rafael Hemsani

Shall I uninstall and reinstall with the new installer? Or just run the new installer?

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Mike Ionas
3 minutes ago, Rafa Hemsani said:

Shall I uninstall and reinstall with the new installer? Or just run the new installer?

Always uninstall the previous version before installing a new one.

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Rafael Hemsani
1 minute ago, Mike Ionas said:

Always uninstall the previous version before installing a new one.

Awesome! Thanks Mike! Will do!

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Sebastião Ferreira

 

Quote

2) REVIEW THE SECURITY NOTICE IN THE LICENSE AGREEMENT.  This will
    prevent you from unwanted legal involvement related to this
    product and Flight Sim Labs Ltd.'s aggressive defense of our digital
    property rights

inside a README from FSLabs, so we were kinda of warned. Anyway, hope for the best to everyone (us users and you devs).

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Michael Avallone
3 hours ago, aru maw akkc1rtap said:

lol. get nerds nervous about their porn site passwords and pirates looking over their backs, all hell breaks lose.  

eligit activation--nothing to worry about. 

pirates--you get what you deserve.

LOL this ^^^^

 

Talk about a overreaction, wow..    I run a legit copy so I am moving on to real things in my life to worry about. 

 

 

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Vimal Ana
32 minutes ago, Michael Avallone said:

LOL this ^^^^

 

Talk about a overreaction, wow..    I run a legit copy so I am moving on to real things in my life to worry about. 

 

 

Overreaction? I think not. Potentially having malware as a form of drm doesnt sit with me well. Legit copy or not. For a 140 bucks, a more elegant solution for drm should have been used. 

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Miles Harrison

Hi team FSlabs,

Today has been a shock to see what is written, yes probably saying you were going to do a tracking software was the best thing to do. I have seen such paranoia that I am beyond words. Lawsuits etc and one well kn

own you tuber/ twitt

er renowned in the community making himself look such a fool. for not the first time  I don't think in 35 years of simming I have seen such bad publicity but i trust you and feel that the majority has your back. Maybe all developers should do the same, yes maybe next time be upfront to catch the pirates. We all need to move forward as for me I have not been compromised and believe this is the best update we have had from a developer to date as we had to wait till it was right.

This morning you will hold your meeting and good things will come. Whatever comes you will come over this and continue. I support your actions although be open next time.

 

Cheers

 

Miles

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Romain Roux

I'm one the few who are not comfortable with the idea to have a malware even temporarily stored on my drive even though I have a legit copy and I'm well aware of the need to fight pirates. Only this way didn't suit me well.

However I appreciate the swift reaction from FSL to remove that DRM check file and I'm happy to fly the A320 and support FSL again as long as this kind of surprise don't come in the way again.

I have no issue with online activation and license key check but it must not go too far such as to use a tool that could retrieve personnal data in whatever circumstances coming from a private company without even being informed first of that possibility. The laws are clear on that topic and a user must be informed when their personal info can be retrieved, stored, transferred (whatever the reason for that).

Anyway, the case is closed on my side and I thank FSL for having listened the concern.

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craig mackey

i'll stick with v231 - thanks...

a veritable 'storm in a teacup' from the "hornets' nest"...

most would not believe what real-world practised DRM/authentication actually occurs - for a very long time now on the 'net...

swift response FSL ;)

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James Goggi

Hi, I am reading this post just now and I am not well aware of what happened. Since I don't have much time ahead, could anyone explain in few words what happened and, above all, what could happen if I DON'T update my bus with the .232 installer? (It's working very well at the moment and I wouldn't like to break anything). Thanks.

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Matthew Webb

Does this storm in a teacup appear on the FSL 320 weather radar or will that be in a future version?

 

LastPass has this functionality.  This isn't malware .

 

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Markus Bendel

Didn't PMDG get into a lot of trouble a couple of years ago when the corrupted FSX installations on purpose because the installer identified an illegal copy and didn't it affect some legit customers, too? Do I remember correctly that you, @Lefteris Kalamaras, could share some insights on this...?

So, what if the great minds (or some Dev) at PMDG screws up badly next time and their "test.exe" (or whatever they'll call it) decides to send all my (legit!) serials to their servers, which becomes hacked by some scripting kiddy, who publishes my serials on one of the aforementioned scum sites.

Voilá, your "test.exe" (that you've removed by now) does its thing without me doing anything wrong. Thanks a bunch!

The story is just too crazy or too unlikely? Definitely! But would you mind NOT putting malware on any computer?! Oh, now you stopped--so why would I even bother? :angry:

(Oh, and what happens if the one-in-a-trillion thing happens and one of the "pirate serials" is different by one character from my legit one and I accidentally mistype this very character during installation? Hang on, also too unlikely. And if someone on your side screws up and flags a legit serial as pirate one? Also unlikely. And what if someone...--you see where I'm going with this...?)

EDIT: just in case somebody here still didn't get it (@DeanJohnston2717 for instance): SPREADING. MALWARE. IS. UNETHICAL-INACCAPTABLE-ILLEGAL. And it so does not matter if it gets executed or not.

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Norman Blackburn
17 minutes ago, James Goggi said:

Hi, I am reading this post just now and I am not well aware of what happened. Since I don't have much time ahead, could anyone explain in few words what happened and, above all, what could happen if I DON'T update my bus with the .232 installer? (It's working very well at the moment and I wouldn't like to break anything). Thanks.

In short James, nothing different occurs.

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craig mackey

if anyone is paranoid about DRM/authentication...

disconnect from the 'net...

THEN, permanently shut down your computer for good...

simple & no more worries... 

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Mikael Leinonen
23 minutes ago, Norman Blackburn said:

In short James, nothing different occurs.

Big Fuss for nothing apparently, if you are a legitimate customer and have nothing to hide, so it seems... Staying with V231 that works just fine "malware" or not ^_^

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Paul Parkin

I think we all need to calm down a bit, FSL hasn’t given us the exact trigger scenarios or what happens when this is triggered. They’ve released an update and my hyperactive AV that keeps blocking the UK2000 installers has never detected any infidelity.

I'm not a fan of DRM by any means (remember the root kits from the likes of Sony of ten years ago?), but launching a class action lawsuit against someone on another continent is frivolous to say the least!

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Leif Vidar Pedersen
13 minutes ago, craig mackey said:

if anyone is paranoid about DRM/authentication...

disconnect from the 'net...

THEN, permanently shut down your computer for good...

simple & no more worries... 

 

The attitude towards malicious malware in this thread worries me. Many of you don't even understand what potential nightmare this could become for legitimate customers. The problem is not the fact that they use and need DRM, that's something we all understand, but it's the method used by FSlabs which worries me.

I usually buy a new addon for every new update to P3D, and the FSLabs 320 was next in line, but I'll put that on hold for now.  

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James Goggi
26 minutes ago, Norman Blackburn said:

In short James, nothing different occurs.

Thanks, Norman. I trust FSLabs and I don't think I am going to upgrade to 232. Only one thing: is there any chance that this "thing" (sorry, but I don't know how to call it) used to verify that the software is legitimate, could slow down my sim in any way? Is it active while the sim is running?

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Norman Blackburn
Just now, James Goggi said:

Thanks, Norman. I trust FSLabs and I don't think I am going to upgrade to 232. Only one thing: is there any chance that this "thing" (sorry, but I don't know how to call it) used to verify that the software is legitimate, could slow down my sim in any way? Is it active while the sim is running?

Zero James.  As your credentials were legitimate the file would have been deleted without ever being used.

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craig mackey
2 minutes ago, Leif Vidar Polsefabrikk said:

 

'potential nightmare this could become for legitimate customers'

mate, you are mouthing off - & you are not even registered user!

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Mikael Leinonen
10 minutes ago, Leif Vidar Polsefabrikk said:

 

The attitude towards malicious malware in this thread worries me. Many of you don't even understand what potential nightmare this could become for legitimate customers. The problem is not the fact that they use and need DRM, that's something we all understand, but it's the method used by FSlabs which worries me.

I usually buy a new addon for every new update to P3D, and the FSLabs 320 was next in line, but I'll put that on hold for now.  

Well, it's your loss then. There is no alternative when it comes to a almost fully correct Airbus simulation

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Leif Vidar Pedersen
3 minutes ago, craig mackey said:

mate, you are mouthing off - & you are not even registered user!

I guess you you weren't either at one point in time? As I said, I usually buy a new addon for every major update to P3D. I already own the Aerosoft airbus series and have lately been reading good words about the FSlabs 320. I decided to register to speak my voice so the dev team can get inputs from all of us (customers and potential customers).  

1 minute ago, Mikael Leinonen said:

Well, it's your loss then. There is no alternative when it comes to an Airbus simulation

Yes, indeed. 

Their latest solution is however acceptable, but it still does not remove the fact that they did infect legit customers with malware.  I'm all in for DRM that does not affect legitimate customers, but this one did. 

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Enrique Vaamonde
13 minutes ago, Leif Vidar Polsefabrikk said:

 

The attitude towards malicious malware in this thread worries me. Many of you don't even understand what potential nightmare this could become for legitimate customers. The problem is not the fact that they use and need DRM, that's something we all understand, but it's the method used by FSlabs which worries me.

I usually buy a new addon for every new update to P3D, and the FSLabs 320 was next in line, but I'll put that on hold for now.  

Leif, we DO understand. FSL screwed up and they have now fixed it somehow. I'm sure it's a lesson learned and we should let the dust settle.

I work in cybersecurity and the amount of paranoia running around is just crazy. On the technical side there's nothing to worry about, and I understand the ethical side of it which troubles many here - and I partly agree. 

However, I think it's just a minor screw-up by a sincere bunch. I for one can't wait for this thread to get locked and everyone moves on.

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Logan Waldman
1 minute ago, Leif Vidar Polsefabrikk said:

does not remove the fact that they did infect legit customers with malware

 

or, as Lefteris puts it,

Quote

1) First of all - there are no tools used to reveal any sensitive information of any customer who has legitimately purchased our products. We all realize that you put a lot of trust in our products and this would be contrary to what we believe.

 

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Mikael Leinonen
18 minutes ago, Leif Vidar Polsefabrikk said:

I guess you you weren't either at one point in time? As I said, I usually buy a new addon for every major update to P3D. I already own the Aerosoft airbus series and have lately been reading good words about the FSlabs 320. I decided to register to speak my voice so the dev team can get inputs from all of us (customers and potential customers).  

Yes, indeed. 

Their latest solution is however acceptable, but it still does not remove the fact that they did infect legit customers with malware.  I'm all in for DRM that does not affect legitimate customers, but this one did. 

Well if you are a legimite customer then this doesn't concern you. Read earlier posts, when determined your serial isn't blackilisted, then installer removes this "malware program" so nothing is infected after all. You can use latest V232-installer that doesn't even have this "malware" on it, to install :D Let's enjoy  the simulation of an Airbus after all!

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Pawel Chadaj

I still wonder what do they do with this stolen chrome passwords of A320 users.

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Matthew Webb
29 minutes ago, Leif Vidar Polsefabrikk said:

Their latest solution is however acceptable, but it still does not remove the fact that they did infect legit customers with malware.  I'm all in for DRM that does not affect legitimate customers, but this one did. 

You better remove Chrome, Firefox and other browsers in that case as they are also malware.

https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/95418?hl=en

https://www.howtogeek.com/333047/how-to-migrate-all-your-data-from-chrome-to-firefox

 

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Mikael Leinonen
13 minutes ago, Pawel Chadaj said:

I still wonder what do they do with this stolen chrome passwords of A320 users.

Why do you worry about this as you're an verified user? As this "malware program" gets deleted after determining are you a legitimite customer, it gets deleted so nothing gets done with passwords or other details

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Matthew Webb
16 minutes ago, Parag sawant said:

so they sold a malware for 140$........

If that's what you bought it for AND you are using a pirated key, then yes.  :)

 

(see how silly that sounds, now let's calm down, shall we?)

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