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Autoland update 184


Camille MOUCHEL

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G€offr€y F€rnand€z
20 hours ago, lodestar said:

Try to install Flytampa Dubai, don't run Vector elevation correction and "MakeRunways" and it will slam into the runway every time. After you run it, every time landing should be a kiss.

So I installed EGPH airport from UK2000, tried autoland and had a hard landing (-900 ft/min). Then I ran the MakeRunways utility and next autoland was smooth (about -100FPM). But I don't have a bootstrap test to insure fiability and reproducability of that observation. and I don't see or remember any logical link between MakeRunways and the A320-X.

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That's not correct, however. The limitation on autopilot engagement in the FCOM is MDA for a non-precision approach, or 1

Hi guys, As you may know, i have concerns regarding the current flare mode of the bus, so I decided to check the Autoland and I think that there is a flaw too. Indeed, the bus barely flared and smas

So my test was for what? For you to say i am wrong. Thats me out of this convo.

Zeljko Budovic
3 hours ago, Palaio Odeyo said:

So I installed EGPH airport from UK2000, tried autoland and had a hard landing (-900 ft/min). Then I ran the MakeRunways utility and next autoland was smooth (about -100FPM). But I don't have a bootstrap test to insure fiability and reproducability of that observation. and I don't see or remember any logical link between MakeRunways and the A320-X.

That's my experience too, the only difference is that i ran MakeRunways + Ftx Vector Elevation Correction Tool. I did 3-4 landings before, 3-4 after on different airports. Before was every time more then -500fpm, after - less then -100fpm. Hard to belive it's just a coincidence, but you newer know...

I was actualy tuning / testing FSX performance and just decided to test autoland too, after reading about problems here in forum. After a couple of very hard landings, i loaded PMDG 777 to compare performance, and during take off roll RAAS was screaming - "on taxiway", "on taxiway"! This is how i got the idea about elevation / runway position issues :lol:    It could be something - Vector corrects elevations and MakeRunways reads all runways data, but i also can't remember anything about FSL actualy using this data

 

P.S. I wonder if FSL "runways.bin" is updated every time we install new addon scenery

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Kevin Hall
On 07/01/2017 at 7:07 PM, njflyer said:

1) the TD rate of 300 was the first time I ever had such a "smooth" touchdown

2) I understand results will vary between users, this is not xbox and I accept that, I dont accept you telling me what to question, specially when I only stated that I was puzzled to see different results, if you feel that I was questioning you or your test, or was attacking you, you are wrong.

3) If the Aircraft flares and results in a 500-700fpm as I have consistently noticed, then it doesn't matter that the airplane flare or not, in my case the A320 will flare and FMA indicates FLARE but TD rates are unacceptable.  I have experienced flares IRL that resulted in hard touch down more than once

4) I don't even use autoland for my flights unless the approach requires it, I was simply trying to help, lesson learned. Case closed

1. In contrast, I have always had a smooth touchdown if I select a decision height of 100 ft. So our experiences are very different with the same software. For the 20 nm test I set my sim up with an MDA of 402 ft (200 ft above field) which has always previously led to a hard, no flare landing. What DH/MDA do you use?

2. You agree that differences are to be expected so why be puzzled by my report? It sounded like you felt my observation might be erroneous, but I accept you didn't mean it that way.

3. Typically on an ILS you will have a VS of about -700 fpm at 50 ft. If your sim usually touches down at -500-700 fpm then it hasn't really flared at all. Any VS reduction was probably due to ground effect. If you saw -300 fpm on the 20 nm final then some flare clearly occurred on that landing. So some improvement was apparent, even if not much. In fact we both saw an improvement (I was expecting no flare as usual).

4. Neither do I. The first autoland I ever tried in the A320X was as a result of reading this thread. We are all trying to help FSL find the cause of this anomaly. No need to fall out over it.

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Kevin Hall
On 07/01/2017 at 11:06 PM, lodestar said:

Ok, i did a lot of test and here is what i found: It's definitely something about elevation. Do you(with hard landings)use ftx vector? If so, run vector elevation correction and Pete's "MakeRunways" utility, you can find it here http://www.schiratti.com/dowson.html (not sure the second is needed for FSL, but it's needed for other addons).

They need to be run every time you install, activate / deactivate new scenery. I found this to be issue with autoland, FSL don't flare becouse it "thinks" it's not time to flare yet, becouse of elevation issues.  @Andrew Wilson  i tested it several times, and i'm sure. I have no a idea how FSL A320 reads elevations, from FSX or from it's own database, but i'm sure this is causing problems. When you install addon airport and elevation is different then stock FSX, there is a FSX bug - it reads elevations from scenery.cfg and it takes into account the lowest entry(which is a stock FSX Airport) - this is why ORBX AEC is so low in scenery.cfg. 

Try to install Flytampa Dubai, don't run Vector elevation correction and "MakeRunways" and it will slam into the runway every time. After you run it, every time landing should be a kiss.

This is how it works on my system, and i tested it several times with different addon airports that have different elevation then stock FSX airports

I don't have FTX vector installed so I don't get a hard landing every time, but I can induce a hard landing by using a high DH/DA selection in the FMGC. It could be there are multiple causes, and that FTX elevation issues are making it worse.

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Norman S Bowman

has this topic run the distance?

Due to the many varied hardware combinations in use,some with many add on bits to others with very little in the way of hardware,it does make one ask if we spend too much time chasing the perfect autoland when we all do not as a matter of course use it.I am sure that the people that use autolands  a lot would have complained in a loud voice as soon as the update was released.

This hobby can cause friction between simmers over  very small items at the best of times so can we on this forum please try and keep things civil and friendly. 

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Camille MOUCHEL

But the autoland ( irl) only uses RA to flare why does airport elevation matter ?


Envoyé de mon iPhone en utilisant Tapatalk

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Camille MOUCHEL

For Guys that get normal
Landing , can you guys do an autoland with the Flight control page displayed in the ND

Because there is no elevation deflection during flare each time thus a hard landing


Envoyé de mon iPhone en utilisant Tapatalk

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Andrew Wilson
11 hours ago, lodestar said:

P.S. I wonder if FSL "runways.bin" is updated every time we install new addon scenery

It is regenerated if any addon scenery is added to / removed from the scenery library.

Our code references this "runways.bin" and nothing that the MakeRunways utility generates. 

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Andrew Wilson
21 minutes ago, Cmbaviator said:

Because there is no elevation deflection during flare each time thus a hard landing

It's a bug we've fixed for the next build. The deflection is simply not showing. 

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  • 2 weeks later...
NilsUnger

On my first flight with the new version I had to try the handling of autoland again. Before the current version it felt like the aircraft flared to early or to much, resulting in the aircraft to float a long distance above the runway. 

This was the first time everything looked as I would expect it to look. Nice flare and perfect decrab. We touched down firmly but far from hard.

Fslabs, whatever you changed, it seems to work very good on my system. Thank you! 

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